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chbright

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About chbright

  • Birthday 05/17/1983

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  1. That's a screaming deal. Out of my budget and, well, I am knee deep in a Miata. But for 2 full built cars, a boat load of spares, a running spare car, and a trailer, someone is getting a full # car team package. And a fairly well built one too. GLWS!
  2. Who says we can't find a smaller aluminum rad that packages better now that it's free? Looking at the mini sprint or another small rad plus ducting to keep it small as possible and still efficient. Rads are a fun box that just got opened.
  3. Building a Miata here too. Have you looked over at Miataturbo.net ? Lots of info there. From cheap coilovers (with an NB you may be closer to a ok suspension than you think, check the DIY coilovers thread), to cheap aero, to seat fittings, to wheel/tire info. The coilovers and aero don't have to be thousands to be effective in champ with a Miata. It will be great mid pack or better pace into and out of the corners. Down the straight and pit frequency, well welcome to a Miata.....
  4. Wild, the picture worked this morning.
  5. so for an 8 hr race, 3 stops vs 4 stops. The 4 minute pit stop likely gets only part of a lap back at best vs 5. 3 is maybe getting close to 1 of those back. but still not equal to the ability to go the fuel 2hrs (or 1:55 and change every single time). still have to find 4 min of ground to make up, or 2 laps on track with a 2min average lap time. depending on length of the race, it could be 1 stop or multiple more. so yeah 1 min or even 2 vs the lost time really hurts. depending on how this is implemented, i can see it still not catching everyone that can find ways to fill over OEM +2. unless they are going to do the test multiple times in different orientations each time. level fill vs tilled is already a known difference in getting the last bit to go in the tank vs leaving a bubble of air.
  6. 9.10.2.1. Total fuel capacity may be verified by ChampCar via the drain and fill method. The fuel tank will be completely drained and then refilled with known amounts until fuel escapes the fill port. so does that mean the overflow is plugged and when you fill it until it comes out the filler port? At impound the car is on jack stands, tires off; so will the test take place on the stands? I presume the car will be sitting level on the stands during the fill process. will tech and competitors be allowed to ask to put tires on and fill in any orientation other than level on the jack stands?
  7. Also, someone get a logical petition for fuel for points put together. They taketh away some with this test, so let us at least let us pay point to get some back!
  8. THIS! This is the true crux. It takes champ being nefarious. @Final Turn Motorsports I too misread the rule yesterday as a pump out (as so many kept calling it that) vs a fill test. A pump out test could get you busted if you were right at oem+2.0 (legal limit): ambient gas temp in the fill, fill right as it came off track, you get the oem +2.0 in to the brim then close the cap sealing the tank (so the amount cant change and overflow out as it sits), then wait a few minutes and pump out thru a hot set of pumps. basically going from a cold temp of the fixed volume (legal volume if no temp delta) to a hot temp. the amount of gas didnt change but was gamed to change the volume in vs out. basically as you stated earlier, a small density change due to the heating up the gas, but keeping pressure and actual mass the same (oh no not mass!). guess what THE RULES DONT SAY MEASURE THE GAS PUMPED OUT! Its a fill test. But the fill is really hard to get busted on a fill test if you do the test at home with known volumes and everything stays the same temp. So unless someone is really out to get you and chose to protest at the end (coldest car) and also keeps the fuel to go in the car in a hotbox (hot as you can get), then slow fills (transfer heat to the fuel as it sits in the tank), you really wont get a false oversized reading. Ideal gas law is not exactly right for this application (liquid but F it, lets estimate), but if the non believers would work thru it they would understand better. V doesn't change (can or tank), if you keep 1gal of fuel at 90F it stays 1gal with no change in pressure. if you keep 1gal of fuel at 0F it stays 1gal if no change in pressure. Now if you compare the molecules of fuel in each 1 gal container they are different and guess what that's not what champ is measuring. instead they are taking the 1gal of fuel at 90F and putting it in the car's tank. if the car's tank is also 90F it fills 1 gal of volume. if the tank is more than 90F and heats the fuel, it will fill more than 1 Gal in the car's tank, so you are fine. Only way to bust and rea high is for them to take 100F gal and pour it in a 0F car, that 1 gal container at 100F would take up less than the 1 Gal in the tank. That would potentially get you busted, if I was asked to fill, damn sure I am not going to let them find the hottest drums of gas to use........ if they attempt to enforce a pump out, that would be against the BCCR. I would refuse the pump out and point to the rules. What the BCCR says for 2022: EDIT: and no im not taking heat transfer rates into all this because its trivial for what was previously argued. whats next, flat track theory.
  9. the tank and tube will barely if ever change that much in terms of volume due to temps. so unless you go silly measuring it at say -20F outside and it gets to 150f in the tank after the race, its still gonna be a marginal size change of the the tank. only oddity would be if they put cold ambient gas in a hot tank and then pumped it out. as @enginerd and other commented, the measurement will be the going in amount so that should actually help you a touch (it warms up expands a we bit as it sits in there so less can be poured in).
  10. Or to maybe lower the minimum fuel pitstop time, or gasp fuel for points ...... But those are about 1000000 to 1 of happening
  11. How much will it expand in 10 min, a hot car in cold ambient? It may or may not be negligible. I could get you from 2.45 over stock in a cold car you tested at home to 2.55 in a hot car filled with cold gas. That's the huge fear and loathing here by some. The other side is it clamps down on fuel for folks just at the 2hr mark on one "tank" in the current system. There will be a lot with less fuel and 1 more pitstop now. But that a whole nother ball of wax.
  12. To the point: if tech puts cold 15 gallons in a hot car and it sits, it will expand and when measured hot, it will be more than 15 gal going in. That's the real point here on the measurement system. Didn't you experience this EXACT thing at Indy where the fuel was fine once you pored it in the car but was overflowing once it sat on the grid waiting for the race to start? I know some bmw had this actually happen at Indy.
  13. Yes that's a succinct form of the idea. The crux of this idea is more from an administrative side as it is more than simple data dump, and I fully admitting it and aware of it. Yes the modifiers are for primarily points over 500 and for fuel capacity but spit into a how much speed they are worth. Yes I don't have the % numbers in stone and they were thumb in the air guesses. 1% at a 120 second track is 1.2 sec, so that's around a lap per stint, so yeah that could move to a smaller % number. Then again I bet teams have that variation between drivers. That's in part why the last idea is some standard deviation check, but I cant find a way to write one up, also a low standard deviation would possibly show teams racing to a lap time.
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