Administrators Bill Strong Posted August 28, 2017 Administrators Report Share Posted August 28, 2017 We had two battery issues at Gingerman. One. Lipo battery caught fire. Two. On tbe focus rollover tge battery was mounted in the rear spare tire area with a marine box and nylon belt takedown. The belt failed allowing the battery to fly around the cockpit. 20170826_144654.mp4 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators Bill Strong Posted August 28, 2017 Author Administrators Report Share Posted August 28, 2017 See the belt in the battery box and see how much it was stretched? It's only 1/2" wide now Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators Bill Strong Posted August 28, 2017 Author Administrators Report Share Posted August 28, 2017 Where the battery ended up 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators Bill Strong Posted August 28, 2017 Author Administrators Report Share Posted August 28, 2017 So... I went around the line of cars at the Gingerman lunch time red flag and too pics of battery Installs 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators Bill Strong Posted August 28, 2017 Author Administrators Report Share Posted August 28, 2017 I'll post up all the battery install pics when I get to better internet 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DRVOLKS Posted August 28, 2017 Report Share Posted August 28, 2017 First off you should use a bar and long bolts or threaded rods to hold the batter down. Thinking a strap would do a good job!! same thing I thought till the L@@@@ tech drilled me on it he was right!! I still us the strap for the cover I think we should make it mandatory. Bob Mann www.DRVOLKS.com bobtec@comcast.net Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jab31169 Posted August 28, 2017 Report Share Posted August 28, 2017 I screamed at my phone for a good 15 seconds after that guy rolled over asking him to hit the kill switch....made me nervous just watching it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jamie Posted August 28, 2017 Report Share Posted August 28, 2017 Fun fact about the lipo batteries. The gas that the battery releases is highly flammable and they are a bitch to put out once they catch. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Team Infiniti Posted August 29, 2017 Report Share Posted August 29, 2017 Marine battery boxes with straps need to be banned, they do absolutely zilch when asked to contain 30-60 lbs exposed to high g-load. (learned during demo derbys) We use a heavy plastic wheelchair battery box mounted in a fitted angle iron base welded to the floor with all-thread on the long sides holding another piece of angle to the top. Crash tested! 7 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TBone Posted August 29, 2017 Report Share Posted August 29, 2017 The plastic box is just to contain the acid from a broken battery. It's not the tie-down mechanism. Our battery was secured with all thread and angle iron. The plastic box around it was responsible for nothing but surrounding the secured battery. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pee Wee Posted August 29, 2017 Report Share Posted August 29, 2017 I only hope the straps in the picture are only there to hold the cheesy lid required by CHUMP. Batteries need bolted in the car and should have a minimum requirement spelled out in the rulebook. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reidry Posted August 29, 2017 Report Share Posted August 29, 2017 17 minutes ago, Team Infiniti said: Marine battery boxes with straps need to be banned, they do absolutely zilch when asked to contain 30-60 lbs exposed to high g-load. (learned during demo derbys) Marine battery boxes are not up to the task. You'd never see those things in an offshore racing boat either. Ours is constrained at the bottom with angle and a section of channel on top with a section of rubber in compression. I also built a divider between the trunk space and the cabin, in the event of a wreck the battery could be punctured, I do not want to be sharing space with it. Ryan Empty Pockets Racing 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Technical Advisory Committee Chris Huggins Posted August 29, 2017 Technical Advisory Committee Report Share Posted August 29, 2017 I cant believe those batteries passed tech inspection... That is horrible. Those plastic battery boxes & straps are designed to contain the liquid or vapor, not to restrain the battery itself. There needs to be a mechanical tie down inside the battery box to hold the battery in place. Steel and Allthread are good solutions. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thewheelerZ Posted August 29, 2017 Report Share Posted August 29, 2017 1 hour ago, Huggy said: I cant believe those batteries passed tech inspection... That is horrible. Those plastic battery boxes & straps are designed to contain the liquid or vapor, not to restrain the battery itself. There needs to be a mechanical tie down inside the battery box to hold the battery in place. Steel and Allthread are good solutions. I don't believe that anyone has ever asked us to open our battery box to show the mounting in order to pass tech. Which is a bit surprising now that I think about it. Ours would pass, but still... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tommytipover Posted August 29, 2017 Report Share Posted August 29, 2017 15 hours ago, Bill Strong said: Where the battery ended up The HOT terminal is not insulated either... that could have been ugly on several counts. Imagine getting smacked in the head by that and THEN the damn thing shorts across the terminals and starts a fire or blows up! Remember kids, the kill switch doesn't work if the terminals are shorted. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Technical Advisory Committee Ray Franck Posted August 29, 2017 Technical Advisory Committee Report Share Posted August 29, 2017 I'd rather be smacked in the helmet with it than catch it in the middle of the chest . I have seen many battery boxes opened In tech to see how the batteries are mounted .. bet all will be opened up now ,but who would hold one in with a strap .. wa never mind . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hotchkis23 Posted August 29, 2017 Report Share Posted August 29, 2017 Since the top of the three pics posted is our car, the battery is tied down with a metal bracket system(from Summit I believe), the marine box was modified to fit around it as the rules say it needs to be in a sealed container(if I remember correctly?) The strap only keeps the lid on the box. As this has no become a teachable moment, time for it to either be written into the rules that it isn't allowed, or it remains as it is now as a "bad idea" and we call people out for doing what they thought was enough. Not every team is a team of race car pros that knows what will happen in a crash and could cause harm. Since tech is now mainly a check of safety items anyway, just make this one more thing they add to their checklist. Heck, for the next couple races, bring along 20-30 or the metal tie down kits and sell them to teams that don't have batteries mounted securely. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bremsen Posted August 29, 2017 Report Share Posted August 29, 2017 I found an XS Power metal case that was slightly larger than our LIFEPO battery. I used some leftover A/B foam to take up the extra space in the box. Welded the box to the floor board, fabbed a bar to bolt the battery in and made an aluminum lid for it. That being said, I've been considering moving it into the engine bay. Both for safety and so I can put a passenger seat in the car when doing track/testing days. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tommytipover Posted August 29, 2017 Report Share Posted August 29, 2017 My car came with a lead-acid in the passenger compartment. When I go LIFEPO, gonna put that bad boy back in the engine compartment to shorten up the cables. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snake Posted August 29, 2017 Report Share Posted August 29, 2017 17 hours ago, Bill Strong said: So... I went around the line of cars at the Gingerman lunch time red flag and too pics of battery Installs The series should be embarrassed that that car has a tech sticker on it. 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wvumtnbkr Posted August 29, 2017 Report Share Posted August 29, 2017 Whats the wood for? strap too long? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snorman Posted August 29, 2017 Report Share Posted August 29, 2017 There should be no problem with a strap holding the top of the plastic battery boxes in places, as long as the battery is properly bolted to the chassis/unibody of the car through the battery box. If the battery is properly secured, it's not going to bounce around and destroy the box. S. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reidry Posted August 29, 2017 Report Share Posted August 29, 2017 (edited) 21 hours ago, Bill Strong said: So... I went around the line of cars at the Gingerman lunch time red flag and too pics of battery Installs That strap cranked down over that sharp edge just bothers me. While that edge on the battery isn't sharp enough to cut your skin, ANY motion and it will saw it's way through that strap. Straps should not be allowed as the primary means of battery retention. The cheesy commercial kits at Autozone and Advanced aren't very good either, they use small diameter J hooks with a plastic bar over the top of the battery. Either buy or fabricate an all metal solution for battery retention. The rules already require a barrier between the battery and the driver, after you have an all metal retention system, add a box or other barrier (e.g. trunk partition) if your battery shares space with the driver. Ryan Empty Pockets Racing Edited August 29, 2017 by reidry Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators Bill Strong Posted August 29, 2017 Author Administrators Report Share Posted August 29, 2017 To the guy that says we should be embarrassed. No. We learn from this. You as car builders have to think about where stuff can end up in a car crash. I am a car builder too. We get focused on making the car work and sometimes put the stuff like this on the "To Do List" that never gets done. So this is why I post this stuff. Not to get you guys pissed off. But to get this shit fixed so no one gets hurt. We all have to go to work on Monday. Explaining to everyone at work why you have a Diehard battery stuck in your shoulder should not be something you have to do. All the batteries that I could see on pitlane during the Red Flag. https://goo.gl/photos/tC4DLxn23hEsEFEW7 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators Bill Strong Posted August 29, 2017 Author Administrators Report Share Posted August 29, 2017 This is not much different than the cool suit cooler flopping through the cockpit of the Continental Mustang that did some flips last year. So let's not get negative. Let's get everyone educated on how to make a good solid mounting system for the battery, what a good place to put it, how to vent, and containers to use. Not everyone has $$$ to spend on a custom system. So what alternative is there? 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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