Jump to content

Recommended Posts

No it will not. I ask about that for the t bird. 3 bars in back excluding the 2 down bars. Does not have to be an X between the down bars.

 

1 hour ago, Ron_e said:

  The bar between the rear strut towers might cost you some points.

 

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
22 minutes ago, Cam Benty said:

No it will not. I ask about that for the t bird. 3 bars in back excluding the 2 down bars. Does not have to be an X between the down bars.

I counted 5 bars behind the main hoop;

 

3.2.12. Roll-cages may not have more than four (4) tubes installed behind the main hoop and two (2) of these must include the main-hoop rear-support (backstay) bars without value add.

That being said.. there seems to be a lot of wiggle room in tech when it comes to safety and roll cages

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

You cannot make an x bar with two tubes. Maybe somebody can. We have not got to that level of Fabrication. So....

 

 

There are a few cage builders that do not use a main hoop. 2 bars that travel the length of the interior and are tied together across the top of the windshield, across the door supports etc. 

 

And are we not being a tad judgementle? Seriously, would someone call him out for this cage configuration? That is Yard foul dung.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited by Cam Benty
  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
6 hours ago, Cam Benty said:

You cannot make an x bar with two tubes. Maybe somebody can. We have not got to that level of Fabrication. So....

 

There are a few cage builders that do not use a main hope. 2 bars that travel the length of the interior and are tied together across the top of the windshield, across the door supports etc. 

 

And are we not being a tad judgementle? Seriously, would someone call him out for this cage configuration? That is Yard foul dung.

Not to be a stickler, but you could like this...DSCN2097.jpg

 

Also, be very careful about you explain some variations of cage design between builders.  If anyone is not using a main hoop, then it isn't a legal (or likely safe) roll cage.  I assume you mean the front support bars, i.e. individual bars along the roof and down the a-pillars to the floor tied together at the windshield vs. a u-shaped roof loop with individual supports on each side.  

 

As for protesting over excess bars, if it is over points then it meets the requirements for a protest.  All that said, I'm not sure the added stiffness in the chassis would be worth the extra weight.  

Edited by jmabarone

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 10/31/2017 at 11:41 PM, Cam Benty said:

You cannot make an x bar with two tubes. Maybe somebody can. We have not got to that level of Fabrication. So....

 

 

There are a few cage builders that do not use a main hope.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Uh, did you not say that right here?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I think part of the issue is Cam Betty is referring to the "main hoop" as what most would call a "halo bar" - the part that is horizontal, located above the drivers head, following the roof line, and starting and ending at what most would call the "main hoop".  (Main hoop is traditionally the vertical portion of the cage behind the driver starting and ending at the floor pan.)

 

Cam Betty's cage uses the "downbars" style of cage, where the a-pillar portion of the cage runs from the floor to the "main hoop" on both sides of the car, and is connected above the windshield to form the roof portion of the cage.

 

The cage pictured in the rule book shows a "halo bar" style cage, with separate tubes connecting the halo to the floor pan along the a-pillars.

 

image.thumb.png.ebac4cdff65b94c54682baaf8ace51e6.png

 

My cage uses the other style,

XX1ZJXGl.jpg

 

Another issue is that Chumpcars rules are inconsistent when referring to the number of tubes for the rear backstay "x" and door bars with an "x"

 

For the backstay, the rules (shown in the photo above) clearly state that a x-brace may be added in the backstay, provided no more than 4 tubes.  What Cam-Betty is saying, is that to make an X, it requires at least 3 tubes (one tube will be un-cut, the other will be cut and notched in the middle).  Add the two main backstays, and you have 5 bars behind the "main hoop" (here, main hoop is referred to in the traditional way, as the vertical portion of the cage behind the driver starting and ending at the floor pan.)

 

For the door bars, it has been explicitly stated that an "x" style is only allowed when run with two contiguous tubes, as shown in @jmabarone's picture above - Also see my cage here:

C2SczZ3l.png

For the door bars, the rules (and forum discussions) have shown that the cut-x is not acceptable, as the joint portion of the x only consists of one bar.

image.thumb.png.fd36a09e881ebdfb432bacc2adc3c771.png

 

 

As for the strut tower brace, expect to pay points for that.  Not sure what the points would be, but a strut tower bar is 10 pts, so thats what I would expect.

image.thumb.png.69e7c8a443899044391b9979efaf2a7f.png

  • Like 4

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I was speaking strictly about the rear down bars or "backstay" bars on the Caddy build. I read and built our cage by the way I saw it in the rules. 

  I may have been a bit unclear with my words. An assumption that we all were speaking about the Caddy rear cage configuration. It became a run away.  

 

Yes Huggy's explanation about there rear down bars is what I was referring to. Our rear "backstay" bars with the x bars. If I take the three 1.75 tubes and arranged them like the Caddy bars what is the difference? 

 

This is all I was referring to. How it blew up after that is part of forum fun.

Race pictures Shop 108.jpg

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
57 minutes ago, Cam Benty said:

Race pictures Shop 108.jpg

I call this "4 bars behind the main hoop" (even though one of those is actually 2 bars), and I think most other people would agree with me...

 

The caddy cage has 5 bars behind the main hoop (everyone agrees on that).

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, enginerd said:

I call this "4 bars behind the main hoop" (even though one of those is actually 2 bars), and I think most other people would agree with me...

 

The caddy cage has 5 bars behind the main hoop (everyone agrees on that).

 

 

That's what I see.  I have no problem with extra bars when considering safety, but if that fifth bar isn't a strut support then what is?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, flyinglizard said:

 The C5 Corvette Bilstein rear  almost fit the Caddy. .. 

Don't leave me hanging, how do you know this and what about the front?  I'll be running KYB gas adjust (non-adjustable) shocks in the beginning with cut factory springs.  Ground control make a coil over set that works with the stock shock.   

 

I'd love to run these (with no laps added, come one new BOD!) https://www.lgmotorsports.com/lg-g2-coil-overs-gen-i-ctsv.html

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 I put Billys in all of my drivers and most of my racers. Even my RV and tow van.

                  We picked up a 9Kmile, 2012 CTS . Rides like a Toyota pickup with no load.   Checked around and they all do. Crap.

 I put it on the lift and wa-la, Black Billys on it from new. I called the Billy tech line and a nice lady answered . I inquired about a part #  for the HD version that would fit as the listings did not show any.  She gave me the C5 # and compared it. About 1.5 in less length. Same ish mounting systems.  I have not got it back inside and tried the C5 stuff yet.  But you can find the data on Oreilly's site . 

 IMHO you may want to reduce the rear spring rate  when you get it lighter.  The Stock rate/frequencies, are very high.  On track they are pretty good but still bouncy. The V is is much better with the mag shocks. Not very easy to just add another shock either.  

Edited by flyinglizard
  • Thanks 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Here are my front assemblies. I’m going to get the car together then figure out how much to cut the springs. I figure the stock CTS springs cut would be a better option over the CTS-V springs cut. Time will tell. 

 

03110FEC-1864-46AA-9B1D-DA7A2D0D3CD6.jpeg

  • Like 4

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Most if not all of the suspension is either new or has been repainted and new bushings installed.  I hit all the aluminum control arms and two rear knuckles with some wheel acid and they look new again!.  

Rear Knuckles.jpg

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Stopped in to finalize the seat mounting. I haven’t seen the car in a few months so it was nice to see the old girl again. She’s being treated well. I’m very impressed with what I’ve seen so far. 

A108802F-DE1E-4DFA-879A-654E6CBA3644.jpeg

  • Like 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I started assembling the rear subframe tonight. I was surprised how many bolts I’m short considering I have so many then I remembered how many broke from all the rust.  

463B9258-EE18-468F-A779-A62D9B07CB08.jpeg

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 11/18/2017 at 5:45 PM, hcsi99 said:

Stopped in to finalize the seat mounting. I haven’t seen the car in a few months so it was nice to see the old girl again. She’s being treated well. I’m very impressed with what I’ve seen so far. 

A108802F-DE1E-4DFA-879A-654E6CBA3644.jpeg

 

 

Just a reminder: CC rules state that all cage welds must be full 360deg. This build is so nice that I would hate for you to show up and have issues with nitpicky things.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

He fits the cage in first then cuts the legs off to lower the cage down to finish the weld on top all the way around the tube. He then welds in the boxes and  attaches the legs to that.  

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

It's hard to say.  I've never built a race car before and I want to do it the right way the first time and make it as safe and as reliable as possible.  That being said I'm sure there are going to be 1,000 things I do different the 2nd time around (if there is a 2nd time).  

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

×