Jump to content

Should FWD Trans swaps be 50 pts?


hotchkis23
 Share

Recommended Posts

Question for all to discuss.  When you do a trans swap on a fwd car, picking on hondas here, should you not also have to claim the diff swap and take a 50pt. hit?(25trans+25diff.)

 

Especially curious since there are no $$ on these items anymore are teams taking Integra Type-R trans w/limited slip and installing them into their cars?

 

And go!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I would think not.

 

My reasoning is that a rearend swap allows for a MUCH larger and easier change of gears or diff type.  I am not sure there are a bunch of options for FWD cars to change the final drive ratio and the diff type.

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Technical Advisory Committee

I see your point and understand the question, but at this point I don't think Chumpcar really needs any rules changes. I don't think any rules changes regarding performance type stuff needs to be changed unless there is a glaring problem. 

 

At the RA chumpionship last week, it was pretty cool to see a Camaro, an MR2, and a Miata all hovering around the track record. I think the parity is pretty darn good. 

  • Like 4
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I guess my real concern is more for LSD's.  I know that once you start playing the swap game and get some of those motors in the 180-200hp range, an LSD is a big advantage.

 

I am also not clear on ratios available, but that's why I figured I would pose the questions to those that might.

 

 

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

With the FWD "transaxle?" swap, you don't get to pick the transmission ratios from one transmission, and the differential (LSD + Final drive) from another.. you get whatever diff came in that transaxle (offered in a car on the VPI list), which means that you get far less flexibility as has been pointed out already. So in comparison to the RWD trans swap + diff swap, 50 points for FWD transaxle is probably too high. If we're being picky, 25 points is also probably too low... but not so low that I would want anything changed.

  • Like 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

oh and I agree we don't need rule changes unless something is really wacko.    @red0 the mix at the top of the Road America list was really cool.  It had to do with many factors, such as the nature of Road America where a Megaton Grand Prix can run 2:55's along side an E30 and a Honda, the full course cautions, 7 hours of rain, and so on.   No matter, still an awesome race and outcome.

Edited by JDChristianson
  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Technical Advisory Committee
47 minutes ago, JDChristianson said:

if it works like the engine swap, it would seem that you can use a JDM transaxle too just tell tech what gear ratio it is......being a bit facetious but is that how it works?

 

 

The JDM transmissions are generally the exact same as their US counter parts, so yes you can probably run one. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I guess a formal definition of what is being regulated would help.  You can change the transmission, the transaxle, the final drive ratio, the differential and/or the type of locking action on your differential, and/or the real axle housing on a RWD car.  A transaxle change may or may not change multiples of those?

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

An example would be the Getrag 5 speed in an Achieva SCX which had different ratios and a final of 3.94 versus the standard 5 speeds 3.64. A LSD was also available.

 

Can be swapped into other cars obviously, including Fiero's iirc.

 

I'd be very surprised if Olds was the only .manufacturer to do this. 

 

 

Edited by Bandit
Link to comment
Share on other sites

3 minutes ago, Bandit said:

An example would be the Getrag 5 speed in an Achieva SCX which had different ratios and a final of 3.94 versus the standard 5 speeds 3.64. A LSD was also available.

 

I'd be very surprised if Olds was the only .manufacturer to do this. 

I’ve been looking for one of those LSD’s. I think they only made 17. 11 of which went to race teams. I think the other 6 came boxed and weren’t installed at the factory, rather placed in the trunk of the SCX that optioned them.

Edited by Kentite
  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 minute ago, Kentite said:

I’ve been looking for one of those LSD’s. I think they only made 17. 11 of which went to race teams. I think the other 6 came boxed and weren’t installed at the factory.

Extra rare, yes.

 

Mine didn't have one. I appreciated the AC. Have seen an Archer Express car for sale that I'm sure had one.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Just now, Kentite said:

Also the 3.94 was installed in all the 2.3 High Output Quad 4 cars GM built.

Sure on that? Or was it just the other ratios that were different. Been over 20 years so getting hazy. Seems the SCX was unique.

 

Either way, it's an example of different gearing with a trans swap.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

8 minutes ago, Bandit said:

Sure on that? Or was it just the other ratios that were different. Been over 20 years so getting hazy. Seems the SCX was unique.

 

Either way, it's an example of different gearing with a trans swap.

 

Yea, but that means that a few FWD cars can take advantage of swapping between 1 or 2 different FDR.

 

A front engine / rear drive car can swap in a Ford 8.8 or GM rearend and pick almost ANY rear drive ratio they want.

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

9 minutes ago, Bandit said:

And it costs points.

So if a FWD drive car swaps a trans that is all the same except for final drive ratio should it only cost 25 points as a diff swap then?

Let us not forget to lump Mid engine cars into this category!

Edited by Kentite
Link to comment
Share on other sites

3 minutes ago, Kentite said:

So if a FWD drive car swaps a trans that is all the same except for final drive ratio should it only cost 25 points as a diff swap then?

Let us not forget to lump Mid engine cars into this category!

Don't forget rear engine and front-engine, rear-transaxle cars.  

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 minute ago, Kentite said:

So if a FWD drive car swaps a trans that is all the same except for final drive ratio should it only cost 25 points as a diff swap then?

If the 1 through 5 ratios are the same I'd have no problem with that.

 

It does get to a point that it becomes impossible to police however. And how many guys would pick out a Getrag versus standard 5 speed. Not many I'd guess. I wouldn't anymore.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Just now, Bandit said:

If the 1 through 5 ratios are the same I'd have no problem with that.

 

It does get to a point that it becomes impossible to police however. And how many guys would pick out a Getrag versus standard 5 speed. Not many I'd guess. I wouldn't anymore.

All the Getrag 282’s use an identical case regardless of gear ratio. They are hard to distinguish from even the Isuzu trans when in the cars. The bell housing pattern on the 3.94 equipped 282’s are exclusive to the 2.3L HO motors though.

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

 Share

×
×
  • Create New...