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Wilwood brake upgrade - points?


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Hi,

 

I am currently running stock brakes but thinking to upgrade, mostly to get something of high quality and not rebuilt Autozone crap. I spend a fortune on blown calipers.

 

1. Do you manage to stay with in 2x rule for Wilwood rotors? (note the 2018 rule change)

 

2. I need some fabbing done to fit the wilwood caliper. Would this adapter count as a fastener with 0pts? 

 

3. I might need a adjustable brake proportioning valve, are these free or under the 2x rule? (oem doesn't have one)

 

Thanks

 

 

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1. Are the 2018 rules out yet?

 

2. Adapter would be materials only if you made it yourself.  If another bracket will work then find the cost of your bracket and compare 2X to the new bracket, if within 2X then included.

 

3. Proportioning valves are free.

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1 hour ago, Ron_e said:

1. Are the 2018 rules out yet?

 

2. Adapter would be materials only if you made it yourself.  If another bracket will work then find the cost of your bracket and compare 2X to the new bracket, if within 2X then included.

 

3. Proportioning valves are free.

1.

I think so, https://chumpcar.com/downloads/2018ChumpCarBCCR.pdf

Brake rotors are under 2x and not free.

 

2. Hmm.....So in order to fit a wilwood caliper from a Ford(?) on my car there needs to be a  special adapter/bracket. There are some companies that sell these. (In theory I could do it if I have a CNC machine or something).

 

 

 

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Oops, yes I forgot about the 2018 rules being issued as we got ready for our big RA trip.

 

Wilwood does make brakes to go on a Ford but are there any Fords from the factory with Wilwood calipers? Or did you mean FOR a Ford instead of FROM a Ford?

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4.8. THE 2X RULE 4.8.1. The retail price of any NEW replacement wheel, brake caliper, brake rotors, or non-adjustable shock absorber that you put on your ChumpCar must be less than twice the cost of a stock replacement wheel, brake caliper, brake rotors, or shock absorber that is available on-line by a nationally recognized auto parts retail chain (i.e. - Napa, AutoZone, O'Reilly, Advanced, etc.). ChumpCar reserves the right to go on-line and pull up retail prices.

4.8.2. Wilwood calipers, up to a maximum of 4 pistons, that exceed the 2X Rule will be valued at 5 pts per caliper.

 

I think that includes adapter brackets as well...

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Just now, okkustom said:

  If homemade only materials cost ..

As a safety concern, this should be highly discouraged unless done properly on a machine, but even then will likely not have the analysis done that wilwood, or example, should be doing for legal reasons.  I believe the bracket is included in the value of the caliper.  I will email Phil.

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And here is the response from Phil

 

Phil,

 
There has been some discussion on the value of adapter brackets for wilwood brake calipers and if they are additional value or part of the value of the caliper.  I would imagine, they are part of the caliper but just wanted to hear the clarification straight from you.
 
Thanks!
 
The following rules apply,
Brackets are added at the sq ft cost of materials
• Materials will be charged at the following rate: o plywood: 1 pt per sq. ft. o sheet aluminum/steel: 2 pts per sq. ft. o sheet plastic/polycarbonate: 3 pts per sq. ft
4.7.5. Hardware, fasteners, and materials used to attach things to other things (nuts, bolts, screws, rivets, duct tape, bailing wire, zip ties, JB Weld, etc.) are open. 
4.7.6. Teams may replace any worn, broken, ventilated, impaled, defective, or bent-beyond-allrecognition parts on their car without affecting their total points so long as it’s an OEM or OEMequivalent part for that car’s specific model. 4.7.7. Wheels, brake calipers, and non-adjustable shock absorbers are open, PROVIDED they meet the “2X Rule.” 4.8. THE 2X RULE 4.8.1. The retail price of any NEW replacement wheel, brake caliper, brake rotors, or non-adjustable shock absorber that you put on your ChumpCar must be less than twice the cost of a stock replacement wheel, brake caliper, brake rotors, or shock absorber that is available on-line by a nationally recognized auto parts retail chain (i.e. - Napa, AutoZone, O'Reilly, Advanced, etc.). ChumpCar reserves the right to go on-line and pull up retail prices
 
 
Phil McKinney 
Director Tech & Safety
cleardot.gif
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15 hours ago, okkustom said:

  If homemade only materials cost ..

 

17 hours ago, Snake said:

Also interested on clarification of the value of the adapter brackets to get any legal bbk to work. 

 

20 hours ago, turbogrill said:

CNC

No CnC or mill was used when we made our adaptors 5 years ago, just some big ass chunks of steel, Mig Welder, bandsaw, Grinder and drill....

there was some trickery during mock up that involved using Lexan but the rest was just in spirit of Chump, worked  decently enough  until moving to a different caliper

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2 hours ago, Miata PI said:

And here is the response from Phil

 

Phil,

 
There has been some discussion on the value of adapter brackets for wilwood brake calipers and if they are additional value or part of the value of the caliper.  I would imagine, they are part of the caliper but just wanted to hear the clarification straight from you.
 
Thanks!
 
The following rules apply,
Brackets are added at the sq ft cost of materials
• Materials will be charged at the following rate: o plywood: 1 pt per sq. ft. o sheet aluminum/steel: 2 pts per sq. ft. o sheet plastic/polycarbonate: 3 pts per sq. ft
4.7.5. Hardware, fasteners, and materials used to attach things to other things (nuts, bolts, screws, rivets, duct tape, bailing wire, zip ties, JB Weld, etc.) are open. 
4.7.6. Teams may replace any worn, broken, ventilated, impaled, defective, or bent-beyond-allrecognition parts on their car without affecting their total points so long as it’s an OEM or OEMequivalent part for that car’s specific model. 4.7.7. Wheels, brake calipers, and non-adjustable shock absorbers are open, PROVIDED they meet the “2X Rule.” 4.8. THE 2X RULE 4.8.1. The retail price of any NEW replacement wheel, brake caliper, brake rotors, or non-adjustable shock absorber that you put on your ChumpCar must be less than twice the cost of a stock replacement wheel, brake caliper, brake rotors, or shock absorber that is available on-line by a nationally recognized auto parts retail chain (i.e. - Napa, AutoZone, O'Reilly, Advanced, etc.). ChumpCar reserves the right to go on-line and pull up retail prices
 
 
Phil McKinney 
Director Tech & Safety
cleardot.gif

 

Still not clear to me :)

 

Is it 4.7.5? (brackets fall under materials, probably 2-3 pts or so for all of it.)

 

Is it 4.7.6? It be considered attach things to other things? ( as in caliper to strut)

 

 

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7 minutes ago, Miata PI said:

more from Chisek:

 

Phil values brackets at points per sq/ft.  Metal is 3 points per sq/ft so take the total sq/ft of the metal used to make the brackets and multiply by 3.  I doubt it will cost you more than 3 points for an axle.

 

Mike

 

Is "metal" a different material than aluminum or steel?

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  • Technical Advisory Committee

    I'm not an official or metallergist but in my chump mind    metal = steel, aluminum ,tin ,and cast iron ..  wait shoot  , hold on I'm gonna Google it ?..      well that was a read ,something that conducts electricity and heat and something called heavy metal  , some kind of rock that rolls ..  quite confusing  ..  

 As far as the skill level to construct caliper brackets it's not hard but VERY IMPORTANT to get right and should not be taken lightly .. on more thought every component in the brake system is VERY IMPORTANT !!!!  A car that won't run is just a problem one that won't stop can kill ..

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1 hour ago, okkustom said:

    I'm not an official or metallergist but in my chump mind    metal = steel, aluminum ,tin ,and cast iron ..  wait shoot  , hold on I'm gonna Google it ?..      well that was a read ,something that conducts electricity and heat and something called heavy metal  , some kind of rock that rolls ..  quite confusing  ..  

 As far as the skill level to construct caliper brackets it's not hard but VERY IMPORTANT to get right and should not be taken lightly .. on more thought every component in the brake system is VERY IMPORTANT !!!!  A car that won't run is just a problem one that won't stop can kill ..

 

I agree 100% .  I think the bracket should be included in the value of the caliper... for safety reasons

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I've been watching this thread and have a question.

Is this discussion assuming everyone is using a caliper that is used with a stock rotor and some sort of adapter bracket? Wilwood makes an exceptional kit for my '03 Mustang but it uses a two piece rotor - same diameter as stock.  Is that still a deal breaker or have they been allowed under the 2x calculation now? (haven't kept up with the rules as I'm still a long way away from worrying about this and the rule will likely change again by the time the car is ready for brakes) How about 6 pistons? Is it assumed any caliper from Wilwood or any other big name manufacturer would only be 4 piston models? They don't cost much more than 4 piston models when purchased in a kit. 

 

Cheers

 

RR

 

 

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24 minutes ago, RapidRoy10 said:

I've been watching this thread and have a question.

Is this discussion assuming everyone is using a caliper that is used with a stock rotor and some sort of adapter bracket? Wilwood makes an exceptional kit for my '03 Mustang but it uses a two piece rotor - same diameter as stock.  Is that still a deal breaker or have they been allowed under the 2x calculation now? (haven't kept up with the rules as I'm still a long way away from worrying about this and the rule will likely change again by the time the car is ready for brakes) How about 6 pistons? Is it assumed any caliper from Wilwood or any other big name manufacturer would only be 4 piston models? They don't cost much more than 4 piston models when purchased in a kit. 

 

Cheers

 

RR

This is the pertinent section:

 

4.7.7. Wheels, brake calipers, and non-adjustable shock absorbers are open, PROVIDED they meet the “2X Rule.”
 
4.8. THE 2X RULE
4.8.1. The retail price of any NEW replacement wheel, brake caliper, brake rotors, or non-adjustable
shock absorber that you put on your ChumpCar must be less than twice the cost of a stock
replacement wheel, brake caliper, brake rotors, or shock absorber that is available on-line by
a nationally recognized auto parts retail chain (i.e. - Napa, AutoZone, O'Reilly, Advanced,
etc.). ChumpCar reserves the right to go on-line and pull up retail prices.
4.8.2. Wilwood calipers, up to a maximum of 4 pistons, that exceed the 2X Rule will be valued at 5 pts per caliper.

 

 

The mention of one-piece rotors was removed, so follow the rule and do your pricing. Getting pretty close to "brakes are free" by the look of it.

Edited by mender
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