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Ron_e

2018 petitions

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I'm surprised nobody is talking about these.

 

Fuel seems to be a popular topic, octane, filling procedure, and amount.  Free stuff being requested as usual.  Some clarification, some wanting to add more rules.  Bit of a game changer from Mr. Chisek.  Tech committee.  Impound for class winners - ugh.

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Is there an official way to petition a petition, so that the board is aware members do not agree with a petition being brought forward?

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3 minutes ago, Z06LOL said:

Is there an official way to petition a petition, so that the board is aware members do not agree with a petition being brought forward?

No need to submit a petition, email your opinion to the BOD.

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Yes, e-mailing your comments to the board is correct.  I believe in the past it has been said they were voting 90+% of the time in the same direction as the opinions submitted on the petitions.

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Anyone notice that Troy is petitioning for 50 points in free stuff, the same amount his car was suppose to increase.  Coincidence? 

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This is going to take a fair amount of reading and typing comments to the board.     Is it an appropriate comment to just use the ol' "not only no, but hell no" when writing to the board?

 

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29 minutes ago, JDChristianson said:

This is going to take a fair amount of reading and typing comments to the board.     Is it an appropriate comment to just use the ol' "not only no, but hell no" when writing to the board?

 

 

I have submitted my comments

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Can we get the petitions numbered?  It makes it hard to submit comments.

 

Should I say the petition on page 25: I think blah, blah, blah.  Page 32: I would vote blah, blah because blah.

Edited by Ron_e
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56 minutes ago, Ron_e said:

Can we get the petitions numbered?  It makes it hard to submit comments.

 

Should I say the petition on page 25: I think blah, blah, blah.  Page 32: I would vote blah, blah because blah.

This is what I submitted (with a 3rd column to the right with my comments)

 

Page Gist
2 FCY procedures
3 Adjustable shocks
4 2.5 gallon surge tank
5 Octane limit
6 Seat position
7 Ban LiPO batteries
8 Reliability mods should be free
9 Safety infractions
10 JDM engines
11 Automatic trans discount
12 Swap calculator error
13 Replacement car eligibility
14 Table of engine HP for swaps
15 More fuel for small cars
16 Clarity on modifications which add points
17 Swap or mod
18 Starting procedures
19 Starting procedures
20 Starting procedures
21 Timed egress
22 Free accusumps
23 Free oil coolers
24 Free radiators
25 Race gas
26 Class changes
28 Parc ferme procedures
29 24 hour races
30 More fuel for small cars
31 Licensing 
32 Fueling procedures
33 Roll bar padding
34 Logbooks in impound
35 Cheating teams
36 Free oil coolers
37 Add diffuser / undertray to rulebook
38 Turbo rule
39 Brake parts
40 Ban aero stuff
41 Big surge tanks
42 Tech committee
44 Class winners go to impound
45 Increase +100 for turbo option
46

Allow dry breaks

 

 

(feel free to copy and paste this into excel for your own replies to the BOD)

Edited by enginerd
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I would like to point something out concerning the petition on page 45 (changing the +100 point modifier for turbo trim). My actual petition email also included this line at the end:

Either that, or, eliminate this rule and create new lines in the VPI table for factory turbocharged models (like is already done for the Nissans... different lines for the RB20DET, VG20ET, and VG30E, all of which fall under the Z31 chassis)

I think it is a better option to simply assign a VPI for each turbo trim car rather than relying on a blanket point increase to cover the performance increase of all turbocharged models in comparison to their N/A siblings. Perhaps the turbo eclipse is only 50 points better than the N/A... perhaps the 1.8T jetta is 100 points better than the 2.0 NA jetta... maybe the turbo MR2 is 200 points better than the N/A MR2. If it is true that these models vary in 'betterness', giving them all the same +100 (or whatever) points is just lazy.

If you agree, please include this in your comments to the BOD.

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Page Gist
2  Yes 
3 Agree, but didn't actually write an applicable rule
4 No
5 Yes
6 Yes
7 No
8 No
9 Like the thought, didn't actually come up with a rule
10 No,  Already can't verify what engines people are running. 
11 No
12 I don't know if there's another way of doing it besides case by case.   
13 Tricky, I like the intent.   Needs more specifics
14 Yes
15 No
16 This is an issue, idk about this solution though
17 Yes
18 Yes
19 No
20 Yes
21 Unenforceable 
22 No
23 No
24 No
25 Yes
26 No
28 No
29 No, Logistical nightmare
30 No
31 We don't even use current licenses 
32 Yes
33 Yes
34 No
35 Yes
36 No
37 Yes
38 Yes
39 No
40 No
41 No
42 Yes
44 Yes
45 No
46

No

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Free all the reliability stuff so I can use those points on speed!  Said everybody.

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18 minutes ago, wvumtnbkr said:

Free all the reliability stuff so I can use those points on speed!  Said everybody.

But, but, reliability makes it so I last and is cheaper, doesn't make me faster....therefore it needs to be free or else I will break and it will cost me money.....not because I've opened up the motor to try and run it at 8k rpm for 8hrs straight.......:wacko:

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19 minutes ago, wvumtnbkr said:

Free all the reliability stuff so I can use those points on speed!  Said everybody.

Not the guy with a 500 point car and an oil pressure problem.  He just says "Yay! Maybe I won't have to rebuild my motor after the next race!"

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2 minutes ago, zack_280 said:

Not the guy with a 500 point car and an oil pressure problem.  He just says "Yay! Maybe I won't have to rebuild my motor after the next race!"

Who would that be?

 

How many stock 500 pt cars are in the rules?  E36?  Are they known for needing any of those items?

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21 minutes ago, wvumtnbkr said:

Free all the reliability stuff so I can use those points on speed!  Said everybody.

 

I would be up for raising the price of all performance mods some percentage to offset the reliability ones. I think it was to prevent what i am doing in my next build, which is removing reliability stuff and just decreasing the time between rebuilds. 

 

I also got a oem rad from mopar, new in box, which is rocking horse crap rare. Guess all the other neon guys will need to take points to replace their old rads with any one of the aftermarket or different car model rads, since the napa replacements are thin garbage. I think that was the sort pf thing they were trying to prevent. 

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Just now, zack_280 said:

Not the guy with a 500 point car and an oil pressure problem.  He just says "Yay! Maybe I won't have to rebuild my motor after the next race!"

In theory though, that 500 point car has a value that was determined on how it compete in 100% stock form, per the staff.  Therefore, by adding that reliability part it would in theory now be able to perform at a level beyond 500 points and deserves to take a lap.

 

Free parts have completely caused an issue with starting values on cars as it is.  How many people are running stock brakes, stock shocks, stock bushing, etc. and not upgrading them to at least a step above oem, for no points, however the values are still claimed to be the base stock models.  Great example was about how slow a stock MR2 is and how bad the suspension is, but if you think about it, it is not actually required to be stock, it can have race shocks, custom built springs, poly bushings, and a big brake upgrade for free(as can any other car).  Food for though.

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4 minutes ago, wvumtnbkr said:

Who would that be? Not relevant.

 

How many stock 500 pt cars are in the rules?  166 when broken down by model year. 

E36?  Yes, plus 159 more makes/models. 

Are they known for needing any of those items?  Yes.

 

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8 minutes ago, wvumtnbkr said:

Who would that be?

 

How many stock 500 pt cars are in the rules?  E36?  Are they known for needing any of those items?

 

SC300 is 500 points.. you want to give them coolers for free so they can run the engines harder?!?!?!

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So free Accusumps, oil coolers and aluminum radiators along with more fuel for "small cars" so they can run 2 hours. 

S. 

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7 minutes ago, hotchkis23 said:

In theory though, that 500 point car has a value that was determined on how it compete in 100% stock form, per the staff.  Therefore, by adding that reliability part it would in theory now be able to perform at a level beyond 500 points and deserves to take a lap.

In theory, you're right, but in reality it doesn't make any sense.  That same 500 point car car can port/polish the head, add motec ECU, modify the intake/exhaust and make significantly more power and still be 500 points.  But if that car has a diff that tends to overheat, it can't add a diff cooler because, that would give it a performance advantage. 

 

This doesn't currently apply to me, but it doesn't really make any sense.

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The fuel for small cars i only half agree with, as i think the real issue is lbs fuel per lbs of advertised weight, which thru swap formula gives you the big power and fuel per weight balancing. 

 

Might need to be re written, if your car advertised (swap formula) weight is 1800 lbs, 15 gallons would murder the field. 

Edited by Black Magic
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