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Wheel Spacers larger than the 1.25" free size?


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Another dumb clarification question, but I will avoid filling the tech people's mailboxes with emails just in case I'm missing something or having brain fade.

 

If you want to run a wheel spacer bigger than 1.25", is it not allowed whatsoever, or is it just an extra 5/10 points per spacer/per corner? The rules seem a bit unclear to me. 

 

We had to run 2" spacers on our old S10 to fit the popular and cheap 17x9.5 C4 corvette sawblades that have a high offset. Some cars like 4th gen F bodies don't need this, I think 3rd gens and G bodies do.

 

In my eyes I could drop a huge stack of cash on some aftermarket wheels that didn't need spacers for a no points hit, so that seems a bit unfair. I'll think how I could draft that into a petition, but anyhow, rules are rules. Atleast if I build a car and need to take the points hit but it's legal to run 2" spacers, I will feel better about it.

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I am interested to hear the response on this. I got crickets when i mentioned before that from a performance standpoint you would get the same loading if you machined 1" off the rim hub depth and added 1" more spacer....

 

From a legality standpoint, your best bet would be to find a brake rotor with 1" more hat depth, use a 1" spacer between the rotor and hub and claim it for free as part of your brake package. Even though it achieves the same end product (wheel centerline in same location) it does it without breaking the wheel spacer rule.

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13 minutes ago, SonsOfIrony said:

Bolt on spacers are a No No, so you need bolt through spacers with extended studs.  Where does one find a 4" long lug stud?

I'll have to respectfully disagree, I know this is a hotly debated topic in the engineering world but we ran 2" adaptor style (non bolt through) spacers for 3 years in lemons, aka demolition derby, including high speed vehicle impacts on the wheel enough to bend a forged aluminum wheel, and the spacers are in prefect condition. Correct spacers (machined billet aluminum, not cast) should not cause any issues IMO. I run them on a jeep with 33" tires as well, have gotten wheels off he ground at speed, and no issues in 5 years. 

 

These were spacers CNC mahcined in Michigan from US aluminum and OEM wheel studs.

 

YMMV of course

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*My opinion*

Its not the sudden loading that will be a point of failure, it might be the 10 studs per wheel(or 5 long long studs)  double-ing chances things will work loose @ Charlotte motorspeedway.

 

I have vid of it happening to a "seasoned, never lost a wheel in 35 races" team (no spacer needed)

 

 

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Every seen a cup car up close? Might change your perspective on wheel spacers. 

 

Loose wheel nuts are mostly caused by poor torque, high bolt stiffness and poor to no torque ring on wheel. Debatable that the longer bolts would actually theoretically hold their torque better. 

 

The only real hatred i can think of with wheel adapters is that they are often not hard enough, lack sufficient design of the nut surface, and the studs can spin getting the wheels stuck on car if the stud knurl design is bad. All of those are design flaws in the details, and not the concept. Made well they work fine. 

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  • Technical Advisory Committee

 Why not proper spindles, hubs , axel's , rotors , and wheels that fit , that's the way I roll ....

 I have used 1/8" spacers before but that's as much as I feel comfortable with .. 

 As far as cup cars when you use hubs , lug studs , and nuts that big , yeah thicker spacers  r   OK 

Edited by okkustom
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4 hours ago, UglyBoost91 said:

I'll have to respectfully disagree, I know this is a hotly debated topic in the engineering world but we ran 2" adaptor style (non bolt through) spacers for 3 years in lemons, aka demolition derby, including high speed vehicle impacts on the wheel enough to bend a forged aluminum wheel, and the spacers are in prefect condition. Correct spacers (machined billet aluminum, not cast) should not cause any issues IMO. I run them on a jeep with 33" tires as well, have gotten wheels off he ground at speed, and no issues in 5 years. 

 

These were spacers CNC mahcined in Michigan from US aluminum and OEM wheel studs.

 

YMMV of course

 

This is not my opinion.  It was the opinion of 2 separate tech officials, at separate races, separate tracks.  If you want official clarification, email tech

 

Bolt on, no go.  Bolt through with hardened studs, OK.

 

I don't care either way.  We only run a small space with our rain tires to keep the tire clear of the strut.

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Thanks for all the input, it seems this is not clear cut as I expected unfortunately. I dont intend to circumvent tech, only to get forum opinions on the general thought as to not waste techs time if the answer was clear, which clearly is not. The rules should state no bolt on then, and I guess I'll address that in my rule petition to them.

 

I won't mention any particular cars as to mingle in their builds, but in my research on this forum I have seen several chump cars running bolt on spacers and some of those clearly being bigger than 1.25".

 

Another Instance of bolt on spacers are old/strange cars with odd bolt patterns needing a change to something more common. 1st gen RX7 comes to mind, or for instance my future build, a Chevy caprice. 5x5" bolt pattern. Shared with all of GMs huge boats, 2wd Silverado and suburbans of the 90s, and Jeeps. They don't even make wide 17" wheels I could use for racing that are under 35lbs a piece, and that's not a joke, I've weighed some aftermarket jeep wheels. I have access to a machine shop and know how to use it, but I feel a lot of people would throw a fit if I re drilled factory hubs to 5x120 for Instance. Can't a guy catch a break? haha

 

The second problem here is, old school American cars had hub surfaces that are hilariously inboard. They used wheels with small backspacing just to fit a 205 tire. Basically, bolt on a FWD wheel backwards, and that's what it looked like from the factory. Want wider tires, and you are looking at wheels with huge offsets. AKA, big money. No, I'm not a cheap out on safety items, but I was hoping I could pick up a set of 200 dollar ugly corvette wheels and compete on a budget instead of being punished for liking my fat American iron 🤠 that requires big wide tires, and paying 300 dollars a piece for wheels, haha.ok, I guess I am a cheapo 😉

 

Not looking to start a forum argument, I appreciate all the input. Just venting, all of my FWD modern car racing buddies don't understand me either, haha.

Edited by UglyBoost91
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Quite frankly, I probably would have already drilled to 5x120 and slapped some BMW wheels on by now....

 

Im not tech, nor giving permission, but considering that drilling for bigger studs flys in other series, and a stack of washers flys for a caliper spacer, thats what I would do. Match it with some low offset 5 series wheels and spacers if you need....

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34 minutes ago, Wittenauer Racing said:

Quite frankly, I probably would have already drilled to 5x120 and slapped some BMW wheels on by now....

 

Im not tech, nor giving permission, but considering that drilling for bigger studs flys in other series, and a stack of washers flys for a caliper spacer, thats what I would do. Match it with some low offset 5 series wheels and spacers if you need....

That's a great idea, I forgot that 5 series had good selections of wide 17s.

 

I'm just a big fan of OEM wheels in this type of racing for durability. A team member "curbed" our s10 at high speed bending one of the vette wheels but it never cracked and made it back to the pits. I like that safety factor

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18 minutes ago, UglyBoost91 said:

That's a great idea, I forgot that 5 series had good selections of wide 17s.

 

I'm just a big fan of OEM wheels in this type of racing for durability. A team member "curbed" our s10 at high speed bending one of the vette wheels but it never cracked and made it back to the pits. I like that safety factor

 

I'm not so sure about the later ones, but the 5 and 7 series from the 90's were all decently low offset (+20 if I recall correctly), and 16x8 was a pretty common size. Last set I bought in 16" was $250, but that was awhile ago. Get the centercaps with them if you can, they go for a decent $$ on Ebay :)

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