Jump to content

2X Rule and Other Oddities


Todd K
 Share

Recommended Posts

So we decided to take the plunge into ChampCar.  Picked up a caged car ready to start building along with a really good donor / parts car.  Reading through the rules before we start working on anything and have a few questions (at least for now).  Most of our confusion is around the 2X rule and retail pricing:

 

- what item / pricing do we use for the baseline?  example is brake calipers - new replacement from common retailer is $65, reman is $40, and this varies depending on the retailer - in some cases by +/- $20 or more.  What cost basis do we use for determining 2X?  The most expensive?  Do we need to provide backup for tech?

 

- Same goes for brake rotors but they are even more confusing since many retailers offer 'performance' versions with slotted / drilled or special coatings for OE replacement.  Are these viewed as upgraded and what would be used as the baseline?  I've found 3 different OE style rotors available with no fancy upgrades that I'd say fall into the good, better, best categories of quality.

 

- Wheels; some models of cars came with various options for sizes and style (14 vs 15"), steel vs. aluminum.  Not knowing which came with our car from the dealer OE what is our basis for wheels? 

 

Thanks - learning a lot from the streaming, forum, and teams posting youtube vids.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

48 minutes ago, Todd K said:

So we decided to take the plunge into ChampCar.  Picked up a caged car ready to start building along with a really good donor / parts car.  Reading through the rules before we start working on anything and have a few questions (at least for now).  Most of our confusion is around the 2X rule and retail pricing:

 

- what item / pricing do we use for the baseline?  example is brake calipers - new replacement from common retailer is $65, reman is $40, and this varies depending on the retailer - in some cases by +/- $20 or more.  What cost basis do we use for determining 2X?  The most expensive?  Do we need to provide backup for tech?

 

- Same goes for brake rotors but they are even more confusing since many retailers offer 'performance' versions with slotted / drilled or special coatings for OE replacement.  Are these viewed as upgraded and what would be used as the baseline?  I've found 3 different OE style rotors available with no fancy upgrades that I'd say fall into the good, better, best categories of quality.

 

- Wheels; some models of cars came with various options for sizes and style (14 vs 15"), steel vs. aluminum.  Not knowing which came with our car from the dealer OE what is our basis for wheels? 

 

Thanks - learning a lot from the streaming, forum, and teams posting youtube vids.

Think of it as a way of saying "don't show up with expensive racing stuff".

 

Lots of teams run the "frozen rotors" cryo-treated brake rotors which, for my car, are about 3x what the stock ones cost.. but it's no big deal, they are still blank rotors and nobody would question you if you had them. As far as I know, you don't want those drilled rotors anyway... use the blank ones... they are less prone to cracking.

 

I've never heard of wheels being questioned on their cost... just don't show up with carbon fiber wheels and you'll be fine.

 

For caliper pricing, look at NAPA or some similar site... look for NEW OE replacement calipers, and pick the most expensive brand... that's your baseline. Better yet... set your area code to New York City or similar to get the highest price.

Edited by enginerd
Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Technical Advisory Committee

 Find the retail price on the good stuff , oem equivalent not high performance  at NAPA , auto zone , ect then double it ,that is your budget on calipers and rotors , pads are basically open . Keep a record of your findings and recipes of your purchase  .  Wilwoods are 5points a corner ,they are a sponser, but don't go beyond 4 piston calipers .  Never show up at an endurance race with drilled rotors .

 Wheels and tires are open other than the tires have to be 180 tread wear or harder .

 Shocks or struts are 2x rule also but cannot be adjustable ,or its 75 points a corner ..

 What ya building ?  

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

A big part of the 2x rule is doing the extensive diligence to find the most expensive stock replacement part you can. Pay particular attention to the wording on some items, as if it indicates "improved performance" or similar, you may not be able to use it for pricing purposes. 

S. 

  • Like 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

9 hours ago, enginerd said:

Lots of teams run the "frozen rotors" cryo-treated brake rotors which, for my car, are about 3x what the stock ones cost.. but it's no big deal, they are still blank rotors and nobody would question you if you had them.

While I get what you're saying, if I was to run something like a rotor, caliper, or wheel that was more than 2x and someone were to protest me, I would fully expect to take some sort of penalty.  That is the rule, isn't it?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Don't know what car your putting together.  We have had very good results with OE replacement Brembo rotors. They seem to be made from good material, resist warping, and last good.  We are getting 3 or 4 weekends out of them.   Last time I ordered them they were under 50 bucks I think from Tirerack.    

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Thanks for all the replies!  We picked up a 92 Integra from a guy on the forum which seemed like a good starting point.  No engine so found a low mileage 91 donor car and we'll keep that around for other spare parts.  Understand the comments regarding parts - our brakes are shot along with rusty hub bearings so didn't want to go spend money before we know what to get.  I figured rotors are throw away items after a couple weekends.  Staying with OEM and not trying to over think this so we focus on getting the build done and on the track sooner rather than later.

 

Our goal at the moment is to make the last Sebring race this year.  However we are wondering if it would be possible to bring out what we have to the September Sebring race and get a tech inspection for our safety items - most specifically the cage since we didn't build it ourselves.  I know we won't be ready by September for the track but want to avoid the disappointment of showing up in December and not passing tech for safety items.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

 Share

×
×
  • Create New...