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What was the official purpose for the dyno tests? Was there a potential penalty that could be applied if officials saw something they didn’t like? Or was it just information gathering?

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7 minutes ago, Kentite said:

What was the official purpose for the dyno tests? Was there a potential penalty that could be applied if officials saw something they didn’t like? Or was it just information gathering?

Information gathering

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These are the laptimes of Ludicrous Speed hunting down Premium Dudes.  Chris - if you have video of this you have got to post it!  Those are some amazingly consistent fast laps, on a hot greasy track.  The Supra's pursuit of the leader was also impressive, but I have got to see the video of this:

 

325 4 02:27.5
326 4 02:26.9
327 4 02:25.2
328 4 02:24.3
329 4 02:27.1
330 4 02:25.1
331 4 02:25.8
332 4 02:26.6
333 4 02:25.7
334 4 02:26.8
335 4 02:25.4
336 4 02:26.7
337 4 02:26.4
338 4 02:24.5
339 4 02:27.9
340 4 02:25.5
341 4 02:26.1
342 4 02:24.9
343 4 02:27.3
344 3 02:30.6
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Just now, Racer28173 said:

These are the laptimes of Ludicrous Speed hunting down Premium Dudes.  Chris - if you have video of this you have got to post it!  Those are some amazingly consistent fast laps, on a hot greasy track.  The Supra's pursuit of the leader was also impressive, but I have got to see the video of this:

 

325 4 02:27.5
326 4 02:26.9
327 4 02:25.2
328 4 02:24.3
329 4 02:27.1
330 4 02:25.1
331 4 02:25.8
332 4 02:26.6
333 4 02:25.7
334 4 02:26.8
335 4 02:25.4
336 4 02:26.7
337 4 02:26.4
338 4 02:24.5
339 4 02:27.9
340 4 02:25.5
341 4 02:26.1
342 4 02:24.9
343 4 02:27.3
344 3 02:30.6

 

I was in the premium dudes car :(. I got PWND. 

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39 minutes ago, red0 said:

 

I was in the premium dudes car :(. I got PWND. 

They were hummin in Chris' car, nothing to be done about that, Andrew.  

 

We had a blast in Biohazard until the axle went kaplooey.  I get in first and the car is so loose I could hardly drive it.  Asked Troy what tires were on and he says "Well, they have AMP, Barber, and the Glen on them."  We finished all those races, so when the car broke we were officially up to 60 hours on that set (some wet hours).  But our deal was that with drivers dropping out, Troy and I had a choice-bring old pads and tires and race, or not go at all due to money.  I'm really glad we went and had fun driving that loose as hell car.  A lot of great drivers and fantastic competition.  None of the contenders ever did anyone wrong that I saw, and only a few non-contenders were guilty of a lack of awareness. 

 

Hat's off to the staff of Champcar who also had to work in that heat.  I really want to bring my Miata to NCM, but I don't ever want to race in that heat again.  debilitating.  Well, multiple stints in a day didn't help too.  

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6 hours ago, Frostycrowd said:

Awesome weekend, we (Blue Catvalier) melted a wheel bearing and destroyed a CV on the first stint Saturday.  Luckily we were able to run all Sunday. 

 

That was the cleanest racing I've experienced, and the corner works/safety crew did an amazing job.

 

I'm curious if the team with the white/blue 3000GT have any footage of me nearly spinning off track at turn 16 (sunday around noon).  Our camera wasn't running but I'd love to see footage if it exist.

 

 

 

Hah, that was me behind ya when ya almost lost it.  I thought for a second or two you were toast, but you somehow gathered it back up.  Nice save !  

No video from the the blue car of ours but ol whitey had a full memory card after Sunday so we think it recorded all the day.  Least I hope so !     Be a while before its posted tho.   I'll let ya know when its on utube.

 

Had a good weekend for all of us, the learning curve of that track was the steepest we've encountered yet.  Thanks for the Friday practice is all I have to say, going out there without it and trying to drive at  race pace would have been crazy.

 

The 935 ( white car ) Saturday broke a front hub on the cool down lap at the end of the day.  Really lucky there it didn't turn into a crash for us if that had happened just minutes before.  Easy repair but it put us into the EC class for Sunday.   Thought we were going to win EC Sunday as we were running third overall when the throw out bearing collapsed ending the day with about a hour left in the event.  Bummer !   Kinda ironic that we could have won a class that as traditionalist we've always been a little opposed of it being in the series.     Go figure 😀 

 

The GT30 ( #66, blue ) had a flawless run both days.  Ended up with a top 5 which we were happy with that considering the competition, the heat and the unknown of the track.   

 

4 drivers, 8 hours driving each over two days.   We were tired ! Very tired ! 

 

Thanks to Mike and his outstanding staff, another great event for Champcar !

 

Congtrats to RVA for the WIN !!!!!    Awesome job.  

 

And thanks to all you competitors ( sans one ) for a safe event.   Lots of heads up driving and really great awareness on a tough track to make passes at times.

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Just now, Evilwheel said:

 

Hah, that was me behind ya when ya almost lost it.  I thought for a second or two you were toast, but you somehow gathered it back up.  Nice save !  

No video from the the blue car of ours but ol whitey had a full memory card after Sunday so we think it recorded all the day.  Least I hope so !     Be a while before its posted tho.   I'll let ya know when its on utube.

 

Had a good weekend for all of us, the learning curve of that track was the steepest we've encountered yet.  Thanks for the Friday practice is all I have to say, going out there without it and trying to drive at  race pace would have been crazy.

 

The 935 ( white car ) Saturday broke a front hub on the cool down lap at the end of the day.  Really lucky there it didn't turn into a crash for us if that had happened just minutes before.  Easy repair but it put us into the EC class for Sunday.   Thought we were going to win EC Sunday as we were running third overall when the throw out bearing collapsed ending the day with about a hour left in the event.  Bummer !   Kinda ironic that we could have won a class that as traditionalist we've always been a little opposed of it being in the series.     Go figure 😀 

 

The GT30 ( #66, blue ) had a flawless run both days.  Ended up with a top 5 which we were happy with that considering the competition, the heat and the unknown of the track.   

 

4 drivers, 8 hours driving each over two days.   We were tired ! Very tired ! 

 

Thanks to Mike and his outstanding staff, another great event for Champcar !

 

Congtrats to RVA for the WIN !!!!!    Awesome job.  

 

And thanks to all you competitors ( sans one ) for a safe event.   Lots of heads up driving and really great awareness on a tough track to make passes at times.

I'm not gonna comment on you know what, because I didn't see it and am not entirely certain what happened, but it was, as always, a pleasure for me sharing a track with you guys.  I thought I was an ironman doing 3.5 hours each day, and yet you guys did more-impressive!  

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1 minute ago, Jer said:

I'm not gonna comment on you know what, because I didn't see it and am not entirely certain what happened, but it was, as always, a pleasure for me sharing a track with you guys.  I thought I was an ironman doing 3.5 hours each day, and yet you guys did more-impressive!  

 

Water under the bridge now.    :)    And thanks Jer.

Edited by Evilwheel
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4 hours ago, mcoppola said:

Good luck with that. Phil's post said it was "allowed." He didn't say if points were assigned for it or not.

Seems like nothing is ever clear as far as rule interpretations go.

The more we ask, the more cloudy things get.

 

Lets see if I can make this any clearer.

You can run any gear ratio thats listed as an option for your year make and model car.  I dont care and dont have any way of knowing what your car started  as an automatic or straight drive.  I dont care if it is a two door or a four door model, I dont care if it was a red, black, green blue or any other color.  Changing of a ring and pinion gear  to a listed option gear ratio will not be considered a swap and will not add any points.

Changing of a ring and pinion gear to a ratio that was not an option will be a diff swap and will add 25 points.

This question has been asked and answered several times and I've ayways been consistent in my response. 

 

Changing of a diff from a stock non limited slip to a limited slip that was not an option will be considered a swap and add 25 points.

reference a Miata 90-93 did not have a limited slip.  94 and later did have a limited slip.  Putting a 94 diff into a 90-93 will be considered a swap and will add 25 points.  

 

Changing to a different year make and model diff from a car listed on the VPI list will add 25 points.  Ref changing to a 9" Ford in your Camaro. 

 

If my memory is correct the car that had points added at gingerman was a swap to a limited slip diff that was not stock for the year make and model not a gear swap.

 

Phil McKinney   

 

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13 minutes ago, Mopar 63 said:

Lets see if I can make this any clearer.

You can run any gear ratio thats listed as an option for your year make and model car.  I dont care and dont have any way of knowing what your car started  as an automatic or straight drive.  I dont care if it is a two door or a four door model, I dont care if it was a red, black, green blue or any other color.  Changing of a ring and pinion gear  to a listed option gear ratio will not be considered a swap and will not add any points.

Changing of a ring and pinion gear to a ratio that was not an option will be a diff swap and will add 25 points.

This question has been asked and answered several times and I've ayways been consistent in my response. 

 

Changing of a diff from a stock non limited slip to a limited slip that was not an option will be considered a swap and add 25 points.

reference a Miata 90-93 did not have a limited slip.  94 and later did have a limited slip.  Putting a 94 diff into a 90-93 will be considered a swap and will add 25 points.  

 

Changing to a different year make and model diff from a car listed on the VPI list will add 25 points.  Ref changing to a 9" Ford in your Camaro. 

 

If my memory is correct the car that had points added at gingerman was a swap to a limited slip diff that was not stock for the year make and model not a gear swap.

 

Phil McKinney   

 

Thanks Phil.

 

One point however, the Miata is a bad point of reference as the 90-93 did have a viscous lsd option available to it.  The difference in the NA6 to NA8 diff is the physical size of the housing and associated internals as they are larger in the NA8.

 

Lastly, that ratio that got the e30 dq'd was already stated by the owner of that car as to being the exact same one in question in this situation, hence the confusion....

 

Also, as I understand your response and thought process here and don't really have a dog in this.  That said following that line of thinking, how does this workout in regards to other parts and options available to certain cars?  What if you car has different trim levels that have different engine hp ratings due to say the "Sport" model having a different intake cam and getting a fancy 25 hp bump as a result?  Does that mean I can run that cam in my car since it was an option and not have to claim the cam swap???  I don't see VPI changes according to trim level?

 

I thought the whole idea was to use base models only and any special edition or options were not allowed to be used without adding points?  Thoughts?

 

Edited by hotchkis23
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^^^Thanks @Mopar 63 Phil.

Wish i could put a Like and a Thanks on your post. 

i am going to copy this response into the topic we started today about this.

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22 minutes ago, Evilwheel said:

 

4 drivers, 8 hours driving each over two days.   We were tired ! Very tired ! 

 

 

That's some hell of an endurance race...

 

did you guys sneak back on the track after everyone left for the day or are there still some lingering effects from the heat stroke😀

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22 minutes ago, Mopar 63 said:

Lets see if I can make this any clearer.

You can run any gear ratio thats listed as an option for your year make and model car.  I dont care and dont have any way of knowing what your car started  as an automatic or straight drive.  I dont care if it is a two door or a four door model, I dont care if it was a red, black, green blue or any other color.  Changing of a ring and pinion gear  to a listed option gear ratio will not be considered a swap and will not add any points.

Changing of a ring and pinion gear to a ratio that was not an option will be a diff swap and will add 25 points.

This question has been asked and answered several times and I've ayways been consistent in my response. 

 

Changing of a diff from a stock non limited slip to a limited slip that was not an option will be considered a swap and add 25 points.

reference a Miata 90-93 did not have a limited slip.  94 and later did have a limited slip.  Putting a 94 diff into a 90-93 will be considered a swap and will add 25 points.  

 

Changing to a different year make and model diff from a car listed on the VPI list will add 25 points.  Ref changing to a 9" Ford in your Camaro. 

 

If my memory is correct the car that had points added at gingerman was a swap to a limited slip diff that was not stock for the year make and model not a gear swap.

 

Phil McKinney   

 

Appreciate the response. Can we get this emailed to the membership as an official decision regarding the rule or at least out to more members than those that use the forum?

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Just now, Racer7x said:

 

That's some hell of an endurance race...

 

did you guys sneak back on the track after everyone left for the day or are there still some lingering effects from the heat stroke😀

 

Course we did, ya always want more !   :)    Nobody stroked out, few baby cramps but we've learned over the years how to hydrate well enough.  

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49 minutes ago, Racer7x said:

 

That's some hell of an endurance race...

 

did you guys sneak back on the track after everyone left for the day or are there still some lingering effects from the heat stroke😀

 

My bad...just figured it out

 

2 drivers each per your two cars...kudos to all four of you👍👍👍

 

Edited by Racer7x
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8 minutes ago, Kentite said:

Appreciate the response. Can we get this emailed to the membership as an official decision regarding the rule or at least out to more members than those that use the forum?

You have your answer.  I don't want an email every time someone wants clarification on what sparkplug they can use on their X-11 because it isnt oem.

Maybe a separate forum with clarification edicts handed down by Phil that can be easly referenced.

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1 minute ago, Choray911 said:

You have your answer.  I don't want an email every time someone wants clarification on what sparkplug they can use on their X-11 because it isnt oem.

Maybe a separate forum with clarification edicts handed down by Phil that can be easly referenced.

That sounds like a reasonable solution and/or an area in the rules section on the main website.

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And a shout out to the Level One miata, they made the end of the day very focused for me as they were super fast hunting me down.   Had to step it back up with about 10 laps to go on sketchy tires and put in fast laps to hold em off.

 

And another shout out to the 901 Motorsports BMW for putting up with me just following them around the track for pretty much all of the middle of the last stint Sunday.  They were pacing fast enough that I was happy just to follow the car, and it was driven well from the driver at the time.   Smoooooooth !

Edited by Evilwheel
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@Jer, was that you who spun in one of  the first few laps on Saturday? I was the car behind bio when it spun and I had a real brown moment avoiding the spin. 

 

I too was incredibly happy with the driving of the contenders. It was the best driven race I have ever seen excluding the non contenders. It was a pleasure racing all the other contender teams, everyone was really on best behavior. 

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Am I correct in saying that there were no full course cautions?

I didn't see any cars that were wadded up.

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11 minutes ago, red0 said:

@Jer, was that you who spun in one of  the first few laps on Saturday? I was the car behind bio when it spun and I had a real brown moment avoiding the spin. 

 

I too was incredibly happy with the driving of the contenders. It was the best driven race I have ever seen excluding the non contenders. It was a pleasure racing all the other contender teams, everyone was really on best behavior. 

Because all the non-contenders sucked at driving? 

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2 minutes ago, Choray911 said:

Am I correct in saying that there were no full course cautions?

I didn't see any cars that were wadded up.

 

I thought there was one very early Saturday, but maybe it was just along the front and I thought it was fcy.  If not, then you are correct.  Lots of good driving given how hard the cars were pushing and the heat, as many have already said.

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6 minutes ago, jakks said:

Because all the non-contenders sucked at driving? 

 

Not at all, just less experienced I think. Many of them were quite well mannered. With the fastest cars closing fast on some inexperienced drivers there were some close calls. 

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1 hour ago, Kentite said:

Appreciate the response. Can we get this emailed to the membership as an official decision regarding the rule or at least out to more members than those that use the forum?

 

1 hour ago, Choray911 said:

You have your answer.  I don't want an email every time someone wants clarification on what sparkplug they can use on their X-11 because it isnt oem.

Maybe a separate forum with clarification edicts handed down by Phil that can be easly referenced.

 

There is already a section of the Forum that was supposed to be used for this. However this section has barely been used, because it is set up for management ONLY to use, and would most likely require Phil to be the one to post this info there. Phil already works a full time job, and most likely doesn't have time to post as often as we'd like him to.

Perhaps this job could be delegated to our media specialist @Bill Strong - or better yet, it would be a great job for the proposed Tech Committee to do - provide clarifications, not make/change rules. I don't think the BOD presented the petition regarding the Tech Committee in the same way as users (we) proposed it would be used. Rather than the typical "ask Phil" being told to anyone who has a question, a member of the tech committee could contact Phil, Mike or their fellow members to understand and provide clarification to the general membership when questions arise.

As some folks have said, not everyone uses the forum. My response to that is that you're missing out on a lot of good information if you DON't come on here. Your loss!

If the forum was not here, how could racers communicate with eachother? Don't tell me FB, as that system has no chronological order to it to track what was said when. 

If you want an example of a race series that has no means of racers communicating with each other (besides FB), look to WRL. Their forum is dead, and I wonder, based on their dwindling entry numbers, if their series is headed in that direction too.

Edited by mcoppola

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2 hours ago, Mopar 63 said:

Lets see if I can make this any clearer.

You can run any gear ratio thats listed as an option for your year make and model car.  I dont care and dont have any way of knowing what your car started  as an automatic or straight drive.  I dont care if it is a two door or a four door model, I dont care if it was a red, black, green blue or any other color.  Changing of a ring and pinion gear  to a listed option gear ratio will not be considered a swap and will not add any points.

Changing of a ring and pinion gear to a ratio that was not an option will be a diff swap and will add 25 points.

This question has been asked and answered several times and I've ayways been consistent in my response. 

 

Changing of a diff from a stock non limited slip to a limited slip that was not an option will be considered a swap and add 25 points.

reference a Miata 90-93 did not have a limited slip.  94 and later did have a limited slip.  Putting a 94 diff into a 90-93 will be considered a swap and will add 25 points.  

 

Changing to a different year make and model diff from a car listed on the VPI list will add 25 points.  Ref changing to a 9" Ford in your Camaro. 

 

If my memory is correct the car that had points added at gingerman was a swap to a limited slip diff that was not stock for the year make and model not a gear swap.

 

Phil McKinney   

 

So does this mean that the early model E30's can't use the late model fuel tanks? Kinda sounds like it unless I am missing something. Or are 0 point items judged differently perhaps? I guess using a bumper from another model year shouldn't be a problem.

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