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V6 F-body point increase in 2001


Terminator58
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On 9/10/2018 at 9:32 AM, TiredBirds said:

Gen III is where it's at...lol as mentioned the later Gen IV's had better parts and better HP numbers. The best bang for the buck F-body is Gen II. 

 

How heavy are the Gen II vs the Gen III / Gen IV if you happen to know.

 

Also, I would love to race a Gen II but they are incredibly overpriced around my neck of the woods. A shell with a moldy interior seems to fetch $2500 if the asking prices are any indication. Meanwhile I can buy a running driving e46 330i for less than that.

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58 minutes ago, CBraden said:

 

How heavy are the Gen II vs the Gen III / Gen IV if you happen to know.

 

Also, I would love to race a Gen II but they are incredibly overpriced around my neck of the woods. A shell with a moldy interior seems to fetch $2500 if the asking prices are any indication. Meanwhile I can buy a running driving e46 330i for less than that.

Gen II's are about 3400 (lighter before 74), Gen III's are about 3250 and IV's are about 3400. Not a huge difference. The thing about Gen II's is the geometry is better, that's why lots of "street stock" leagues don't allow them. And for Chump the points are low. Gen III's (firebirds) are one of the most aerodynamic cars made and can be had cheap. Gen VI's have better suspension and brake packages.  Oh and I go this 99 540i sport 6 speed for $4700 with a new front end, all new chain tensioners, belts, hoses... It runs and drives like a brand new car. Wish I could race it.... 

thumbnail_WP_20180127_12_09_51_Pro.jpg

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19 minutes ago, tommytipover said:

Gen II vs. Gen III. How about "as raced" weight? Do the weights stay pretty much proportional once you start gutting? Or does one lighten up better than the other?

That is a good question. The added weight in 74+ is because of the Gov mandated 5mph bumpers. The Gen VI's have a lot of plastic. If I had to guess I'd wager the Gen III can be made the lightest. There is a LOT of stuff you can cut. The inner door impact bars weigh like 45bs each. I bet our gutted hood lost another 40lbs. Rear window is HEAVY...really heavy. We are going Lexan on the new build...Hard tops are lighter than t-tops too. 

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4 hours ago, TiredBirds said:

Gen II's are about 3400 (lighter before 74), Gen III's are about 3250 and IV's are about 3400. Not a huge difference. The thing about Gen II's is the geometry is better, that's why lots of "street stock" leagues don't allow them. And for Chump the points are low. Gen III's (firebirds) are one of the most aerodynamic cars made and can be had cheap. Gen VI's have better suspension and brake packages.  Oh and I go this 99 540i sport 6 speed for $4700 with a new front end, all new chain tensioners, belts, hoses... It runs and drives like a brand new car. Wish I could race it.... 

thumbnail_WP_20180127_12_09_51_Pro.jpg

I'm confused. Gen 2 70-81 Camaro are used for Street Stocks. Gen 3 is 82-92. Don't you mean Gen 3 are not allowed?

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15 hours ago, cagedruss said:

I'm confused. Gen 2 70-81 Camaro are used for Street Stocks. Gen 3 is 82-92. Don't you mean Gen 3 are not allowed?

not some tacks don't allow the Gen 2's. That is why you see a lot of G-bodys in some street stock classes. I didn't say all tracks just some. 

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53 minutes ago, racerfink said:

Didn’t the V-6 gain 400cc’s at some point in the Gen4 run?

Back in 95/96 depending on the state.  That one is accounted for in the VPI table.  The jump in '01 is unexplainable.  Oh, and it didn't merely gain 400cc.  They ditched the 60-degree V6 and dropped in one of the greatest and most legendary engines of all time - the Buick 3800.

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On 10/4/2018 at 4:18 PM, ross2004 said:

Our 3rd gen is 3050 with no driver. There's a little more weight that could come out...but not a lot, and at a pretty high effort/pound level.

We gutted everything pretty much, probably could have cut another 25-50 out... the hood, roof, doors and deck lid were all just skin. We also cut metal out of the B-pillars and 1/4 structures. 

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Weight in the 2nd gens depends a lot on which F-Body you run also. As much as I'm a Pontiac guy, a true , un-lightened Pontiac V8 (and no 301 stuff) is about as portly as a stripped down Duramax Diesel compared with a Small Block Chevy ; ) That's a lot of extra weight on the nose...

 

With that's said, If I ever come across a 70.5-73 Firebird, It's going to get a Ram Air-3 spec 400, M22, and become a Trans-am clone and run in Chump. I don't care how uncompetitive it is, I'll be in love with it 😎

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1 minute ago, UglyBoost91 said:

Weight in the 2nd gens depends a lot on which F-Body you run also. As much as I'm a Pontiac guy, a true , un-lightened Pontiac V8 (and no 301 stuff) is about as portly as a stripped down Duramax Diesel compared with a Small Block Chevy ; ) That's a lot of extra weight on the nose...

 

With that's said, If I ever come across a 70.5-73 Firebird, It's going to get a Ram Air-3 spec 400, M22, and become a Trans-am clone and run in Chump. I don't care how uncompetitive it is, I'll be in love with it 😎

No worries about the Pontiac engine weight, now you can run a tubular front subframe for 10 points!  Shove the engine back 10 inches and you're now adding rear weight!

 

Oh, and make sure you call it a '77 Firebird so you can use the larger tank. And I expect a call when you need true-blue Pontiac drivers ...

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20 hours ago, mender said:

No worries about the Pontiac engine weight, now you can run a tubular front subframe for 10 points!  Shove the engine back 10 inches and you're now adding rear weight!

 

Oh, and make sure you call it a '77 Firebird so you can use the larger tank. And I expect a call when you need true-blue Pontiac drivers ...

wait a minute... a tube frontend is 10 points? So I can go pick up a Mopar now and be competitive? hummmm 71 383 Road Runner sounds fun

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2 hours ago, TiredBirds said:

wait a minute... a tube frontend is 10 points? So I can go pick up a Mopar now and be competitive? hummmm 71 383 Road Runner sounds fun

You have to call it a tubular front subframe and it must be a bolt-in, but otherwise yes. :)

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5 minutes ago, mender said:

You have to call it a tubular front subframe and it must be a bolt-in, but otherwise yes. :)

WOW... that knd of kills the "affordable" doesn't it? They have bolt in kits that dramatically change the car's performance, not too mention it lightens the car up. Jeesh if we weren't up to our eyeballs in F-body stuff I'd make the switch. 

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