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The Marathon Coach Sebring 14 hour

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13 hours ago, vtjballeng said:

In Today's episode of "Our driver bears responsibility for passing and putting the car there but...."


Maybe we should invest in a horn. Or a spotlight. Maybe a high pressure water gun. Maybe a broomstick for when drivers are within brooming distance. As an aside, we were having some serious brake issues, so our ability to pass under the brakes was limited. Our driver thought, incorrectly, the line was being ceded as he was jamming every mirror and side window full of car for several corners. 

 

 

You have to remember with the limited experience and racecraft of a 1/3rd of the drivers in champ, "out of sight, out of mind" comes into play almost always whenever you try to overtake on the outside of a corner unless you can get at least 1/2 of your car or more on their outside coming up to a corner so you know for sure they see you there. And even then there still is a chance you'll get hit in the right rear.

 

Choose your overtaking wisely, you never know the situational awareness of the driver your overtaking🙂

 

 

Edited by Racer7x

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13 hours ago, SonsOfIrony said:

 

All the worrying about the contour, when everyone should be worrying about that Accord.  Did they not have mirrors?  Were they wearing blinders, and running limo tinted windows?

 

Yeah, he did the exact same thing to me multiple times.  Actually went two off on the straight up to the hairpin because he just came right into the side of me.  It's in one of my earlier videos.  'Glad' to see he wasn't just running us off the road!  I spoke to an official about them after my 9 am run, dunno if they did anything about it.

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1 hour ago, Sully1133 said:

We were thrilled that we survived the race without breaking an axle. That was a first 

Haha wish we'd survived without breaking an axle =P  Breaking an axle was a first for us!

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1 hour ago, krispykritter said:

Haha wish we'd survived without breaking an axle =P  Breaking an axle was a first for us!

Sorry to hear about the axle issue. 

With our Integra this was the first race we “didn’t” break one. Finally have the nose high enough 

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2 hours ago, Racer7x said:

 

 

You have to remember with the limited experience and racecraft of a 1/3rd of the drivers in champ, "out of sight, out of mind" comes into play almost always whenever you try to overtake on the outside of a corner unless you can get at least 1/2 of your car or more on their outside coming up to a corner so you know for sure they see you there. And even then there still is a chance you'll get hit in the right rear.

 

Choose your overtaking wisely, you never know the situational awareness of the driver your overtaking🙂

 

 

 

 

That was my opinion on a lot of these was that the car getting hit didn't "present" himself to the other drivers where in the mirror is filled and it is indisputable that their presence is there.  Most of these newer drivers don't have refined situational awareness.    While not officially at fault, the car getting hit has some responsibility (in the context of being a safe and should have anticipated what likely behavior of the other driver, if the other driver didn't see him).  It's a casualty of this level of racing unfortunately. 

 

I especially notice it when third car is sneaking in behind another car who is in a passing situation.   The car behind passed makes an assumption and focuses on the passing car, not the one behind it. 

 

 

Edited by bam

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1 hour ago, Sully1133 said:

Sorry to hear about the axle issue. 

With our Integra this was the first race we “didn’t” break one. Finally have the nose high enough 

i dig your photo.... im not saying its aliens, but it was aliens.. hahahaha

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16 hours ago, vtjballeng said:

In Today's episode of "Our driver bears responsibility for passing and putting the car there but...."


Maybe we should invest in a horn. Or a spotlight. Maybe a high pressure water gun. Maybe a broomstick for when drivers are within brooming distance. As an aside, we were having some serious brake issues, so our ability to pass under the brakes was limited. Our driver thought, incorrectly, the line was being ceded as he was jamming every mirror and side window full of car for several corners. 

 

I had similar issues with the same EC BMW.  

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3 hours ago, Sully1133 said:

Sorry to hear about the axle issue. 

With our Integra this was the first race we “didn’t” break one. Finally have the nose high enough 

I imagine if it survived sebring, you're good to go everywhere else!

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38 minutes ago, MoparBoyy said:

 

I had similar issues with the same EC BMW.  

 

 

Did it happen on the 2nd stint of the day?

 

The in car video attached looks like that contact happened during the 2nd hour of the race?

 

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4 minutes ago, krispykritter said:

I imagine if it survived sebring, you're good to go everywhere else!

Except for a freak incident at Daytona where something came up off the track and cut the boot. It slung all of the grease out before we caught it. We should be good to go now. 

Hope you guys are done with your axle issues as well 

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Just now, Sully1133 said:

Except for a freak incident at Daytona where something came up off the track and cut the boot. It slung all of the grease out before we caught it. We should be good to go now. 

Hope you guys are done with your axle issues as well 

=O

That's kinda hilarious.  Half-a-job racing blew their engine right in front of us at Daytona 16 and some debris slit the inner boot and sprayed grease everywhere for three hours before we noticed.

Generally, we don't have axle issues, I think this was just an axle that has been in the car for six or seven years, so I'm not too mad at it for letting go now.

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4 hours ago, Racer7x said:

You have to remember with the limited experience and racecraft of a 1/3rd of the drivers in champ, "out of sight, out of mind" comes into play almost always whenever you try to overtake on the outside of a corner unless you can get at least 1/2 of your car or more on their outside coming up to a corner so you know for sure they see you there. And even then there still is a chance you'll get hit in the right rear.

 

Choose your overtaking wisely, you never know the situational awareness of the driver your overtaking🙂


We remember. Hence the "Our driver bears responsibility for passing and putting the car there but...." at the beginning of our post ;). In effect, our driver choose poorly given the drunk like driver before him.
 

10 minutes ago, Racer7x said:

Did it happen on the 2nd stint of the day?

 

The in car video attached looks like that contact happened during the 2nd hour of the race?


Contact happened at 1:02:55PM (Daylight Savings is off in video). The race started at 9AM. We had come in for brake issues a couple of times already so this was the end of our second stint but several other teams third stint if they changed drivers at 11AM & 1PM. Our next driver experienced similar issues with the same car so it may have been the third stint driver of EC #319.
 

2 hours ago, bam said:

That was my opinion on a lot of these was that the car getting hit didn't "present" himself to the other drivers where in the mirror is filled and it is indisputable that their presence is there.  Most of these newer drivers don't have refined situational awareness.    While not officially at fault, the car getting hit has some responsibility (in the context of being a safe and should have anticipated what likely behavior of the other driver, if the other driver didn't see him).  It's a casualty of this level of racing unfortunately. 

 

I especially notice it when third car is sneaking in behind another car who is in a passing situation.   The car behind passed makes an assumption and focuses on the passing car, not the one behind it. 


Our example certainly did not lack the driver presenting himself. The rear view mirror was filled. The right side mirror was filled. The left side mirror was filled. The left side window was filled. Given the situational awareness of this driver, our driver made an error. Our driver presented indisputable presence yet despite said presentation, was hit anyway. Our driver assessed competence that was unfounded.

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This weekend was my first W2W experience. We faced some mechanical issues early on but thankfully I ended up getting a day and night stint in. Exceeded all expectations. Thanks to ChampCar for putting on a great event. I was driving the #352 Black e36 325is, does anyone know what car/team I'm battling it out with below?

 

 

More videos from my stints can be found in the playlist here: 

 

Edited by Taylor Blanchard

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48 minutes ago, krispykritter said:

=O

That's kinda hilarious.  Half-a-job racing blew their engine right in front of us at Daytona 16 and some debris slit the inner boot and sprayed grease everywhere for three hours before we noticed.

Generally, we don't have axle issues, I think this was just an axle that has been in the car for six or seven years, so I'm not too mad at it for letting go now.

What made it worse for us was the grease ruined the alternator too

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38 minutes ago, Sully1133 said:

What made it worse for us was the grease ruined the alternator too

Yeah, that sucks.  Our alternator got coated but it's still going fine a couple years later.

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On ‎9‎/‎26‎/‎2018 at 9:13 AM, bam said:

 

 

That was my opinion on a lot of these was that the car getting hit didn't "present" himself to the other drivers where in the mirror is filled and it is indisputable that their presence is there.  Most of these newer drivers don't have refined situational awareness.    While not officially at fault, the car getting hit has some responsibility (in the context of being a safe and should have anticipated what likely behavior of the other driver, if the other driver didn't see him).  It's a casualty of this level of racing unfortunately. 

 

I especially notice it when third car is sneaking in behind another car who is in a passing situation.   The car behind passed makes an assumption and focuses on the passing car, not the one behind it. 

 

 

 

Not everyone has enough foreword thrust to make split second straight line passes like some cars do.

 

Driving a momentum car requires a certain amount of trust in other teams, and other drivers.  Ive had quite a few situations like evidenced in video above, despite giving AS much presentation as possible without actually bumping the leading car, only to still get run off, or nearly run off the track, in various places.  At some point, you stop blaming the passing driver, and start blaming the inattentive driver being passed.

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Well. Not everyone drives because they can.

 

If they are oblivious on the race track, chances are they are oblivious off-track as well. 

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On 9/25/2018 at 12:34 PM, CutlassRacer said:

 

Way too wide and too slow on entry to swoop across the track to come down to the apex. If I were coming up on a car doing that, to me, they are broadcasting that they are leaving the inside line open and that is where I am going. Once committed, there may not be much available room for correction to avoid contact. Yes, you should always try and leave a plan out of harms way, but to me that looked like he was leaving the inside lanes (like 3 of them) open, then came all the way across track down to the most inside lane. 

 

@krispykritter



Someone done blown up on the front straight

 

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25 minutes ago, vtjballeng said:

 

@krispykritter

"Way too wide and too slow on entry to swoop across the track to come down to the apex."

 

I'm assuming this was to point out that we like to swoop in from a wide line?  If so, then I'm really not sure what to say...the line I took through that corner is the line that is taken by the vast majority of the cars on the track, including yours the lap before the yellow, during the yellow, and following return to green.  If it's okay for you, it's okay for me, though I'd prefer not to bang up our fenders in the process.  I'll admit the roll out was shallow, but I was trying to keep my speed up while letting the muscle car on by.  I don't think I saw you coming up behind me as well.

 

I can't really apologize for being slow.  We had the eight slowest 'fastest' lap at sebring.  That's literally as fast as I can make the car go, and I'm the fastest driver on our team by 7 seconds/lap currently.  We do our best to stay out of y'alls way and do wave-by every chance we get, but I'm also going to stick to the line like glue and let you go by off-line because you've got the power the handling to be unpredictable, and I'm very aware that we do not.

Edited by krispykritter

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I would assume by "too wide and slow" for a line he means that you aren't going fast enough to warrant that type of corner. If you aren't running out to the edge of the track upon exit, you didn't need to be that wide. Like in the video vtjballeng posted above, you had a lane and a half of room to your left as you exited the corner, so you really didn't need to make the turn that wide at your speed. You'd be doing yourself a favor to cut that corner a little shorter and use up the outside edge of the track.

Edited by LAMR2

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12 minutes ago, LAMR2 said:

I would assume by "too wide and slow" for a line he means that you aren't going fast enough to warrant that type of corner. If you aren't running out to the edge of the track upon exit, you didn't need to be that wide. Like in the video vtjballeng posted above, you had a lane and a half of room to your left as you exited the corner, so you really didn't need to make the turn that wide at your speed. You'd be doing yourself a favor to cut that corner a little shorter and use up the outside edge of the track.

 

Agreed that I didn't roll out to the proper line, but I was trying to allow the muscle car by and wasn't sure what sort of acceleration he'd lay down, and I never saw the 240sx (unlike the contact video he posted, he wasn't all over my mirrors for several turns). He caught and tried to pass on the same corner and I never saw him coming. 

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34 minutes ago, LAMR2 said:

I would assume by "too wide and slow" for a line he means that you aren't going fast enough to warrant that type of corner. If you aren't running out to the edge of the track upon exit, you didn't need to be that wide. Like in the video vtjballeng posted above, you had a lane and a half of room to your left as you exited the corner, so you really didn't need to make the turn that wide at your speed. You'd be doing yourself a favor to cut that corner a little shorter and use up the outside edge of the track.

Agreed.  @krispykritterYour turn in was too late and/or you didn’t carry nearly enough speed because you had lots of track left over.  When you do that, it looks like you are inviting the car behind to pass.  No one is saying you can’t drive a reasonable line, but the one shown in the video is a bit unexpected to say the least.  If you take some of these thoughts that these folks are throwing out seriously, you will instantly be faster (and safer)

 

You may want to look at going to an HPDE and trying to get some passenger seat time in a car that is in the top run group.  Try to find the car(s) that should be slow (i.e. a mostly stock Miata) not the ones that should be fast (i.e. a 911 turbo).  If you have all of the required safety gear and a good attitude, most people will let you ride along.  If you ride in a mostly stock Miata that is dogging the 911s and Corvettes in the twisty sections, you will begin to see what it means to carry speed into corners and through them.  Most importantly, you will get to FEEL it (you will initially think you are going to crash if you are with someone who is really getting the car's best).

 

The race track isn't the best place to develop your driving skills is some cases.  If you are running above 50th percentile, it works out OK.  But if you aren't that far in your development as a driver, you end up spending all of your time playing dodgeball (or you drive like some of the awful drivers we've seen in this thread that clearly never checked their mirrors).

Edited by Racer28173
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