Race Radios!!! Help!

[StuPDazzo]

I presume that just about every race team has been down the road of trying to figure out how to talk to the car on the track - without spending $2K+++ on radios?  I've tried just about every alternative I can think of short of not-being-cheap and buying the dang radios that I know we need, but alas, everything we've tried has been an epic failure.  I can understand now why they charge so dayum much for legit race radios, apparently because it's the only thing that will actually work.  

 

Anyway, all that being said, I thought I'd try my luck here on the forum boards to see if anyone might have a workable solution for race comms that doesn't involve a finance dept.  

Any creative methods of race communications you have that work?  Any and all suggestions are welcome.  

 

BTW, so far we've tried:

1.  blue-tooth headsets and cell phones - Fail because we can't keep the head sets charged and/or in the drivers ear, and it's a pain to initiate a phone call with each driver change.

2.  cheap(er) Motorola hiking radios with tactical (SWAT team) throat mics and ear pieces - Fail because the throat mics don't actually work, and reference the same problem with ear pieces listed above, plus the radios don't have the range advertised. 

3.  CB radio hard wired into the car with (loud) external speaker mounted near the drivers head.  This actually works, the driver can hear it believe it or not. The other half of the concept was to only ask the driver yes/no questions that they can respond to with clicks or taps of the mic, 1 for yes, 2 for no, 3 for somethings wrong and I'm coming in.  - Fail because we didn't set up the antenna properly in the paddock and we ended up frying the radio, plus we didn't get any range out of it, likely because the antenna wasn't set up correctly.  Who knew that you can't stick the magnetic antenna in the cup-holder of a golf cart and expect it to work, go figure. 

 

That's it, I'm all out of ideas - short of risking the marital bliss I currently enjoy and spending upwards of $2 large to get some legit radios. 

 

Again, any comments or suggestions welcome... 

 

Thanks - 

Wes

[snowman]

I started here - https://www.sampsonracing.com/The-Expert-5watt-Package-for-2way-driver-to-crew-p/the-expert.htm

 

It's on sale for $500.  We use this with an antenna ($57) and get excellent coverage on track.  Good service too.  I think they give a ChampCar discount too.

[tneker]

36 minutes ago, snowman said:

I started here - https://www.sampsonracing.com/The-Expert-5watt-Package-for-2way-driver-to-crew-p/the-expert.htm

 

It's on sale for $500.  We use this with an antenna ($57) and get excellent coverage on track.  Good service too.  I think they give a ChampCar discount too.

 

@snowman what is the biggest track you have had success on?  The biggest track we run is Road America, if we could have reasonable success there for this price range, we may actually finally pull the trigger on radios.

[Ron_e]

Step 1 - ultra cheap is to use a pit board

Step 2 - see other teams heckling their driver's lap times on the radio telling him/her that the next place is catching them

Step 3  - talk to Sampson as above

 

My team, this actually happened:

Driver: The car is not running right, it is like it is running out of gas

Pit:  Is it doing it all the time or just in corners?

Driver: Just after left handers, I don't know what is wrong but it seems like it is running out of gas

Pit:  Keep trouble shooting, is it an RPM problem?

Driver:  No it is any RPM, it is just like it is running out of gas

Pit:  Does it happen in slow tight corners or long fast ones?

Driver:  Every left hander, it is just like it is running out of gas

Pit:  Is the fuel pump switch on?

Driver: ...silence for the next two hours

Edited November 15, 2018 by Ron_e

[Snorman]

Keep an eye on the classifieds and the various FB groups. FWIW, we bought the set up for our Mustang from a racer who purchased it and basically never used it except to put it in the car. We paid ~$600 for the entire setup (2 radios, headsets, long range car and pit headset antennas, push-to-talk, car radio holder, etc., etc.). As I recall, it was around $900 worth of stuff. 

So you can find some nice deals out there.

S. 

[Team Infiniti]

1 hour ago, StuPDazzo said:

2.  cheap(er) Motorola hiking radios with tactical (SWAT team) throat mics and ear pieces - Fail because the throat mics don't actually work, and reference the same problem with ear pieces listed above, plus the radios don't have the range advertised. 

3.  CB radio hard wired into the car with (loud) external speaker mounted near the drivers head.  This actually works, the driver can hear it believe it or not. The other half of the concept was to only ask the driver yes/no questions that they can respond to with clicks or taps of the mic, 1 for yes, 2 for no, 3 for somethings wrong and I'm coming in.  - Fail because

Beenthere

1. Motorcycle chatterbox, tried hard, may have worked consistently someday

2. Speaks for itself

3.CB, as described but only 2 of our 3 drivers could hear, oh, all the pits can hear...

 

Just spend $600 with a series sponsor and smile when it works.

 

 

[MoparBoyy]

Baofeng radios.  Google them, they are who make Rugged Radio radios.  you can get them for like $34 each.  get one driver headset and the pits dont need anything.  DONE.

 

https://www.walmart.com/ip/BAOFENG-BF-F8HP-Professoonal-128-Memory-Channels-Dual-Band-Handheld-Transceiver/454214556?wmlspartner=wlpa&selectedSellerId=101001044&adid=22222222227107376861&wl0=&wl1=g&wl2=c&wl3=235254844212&wl4=pla-416445457084&wl5=9011756&wl6=&wl7=&wl8=&wl9=pla&wl10=126804364&wl11=online&wl12=454214556&wl13=&veh=sem&gclid=CjwKCAiArK_fBRABEiwA0gOOc8NkagMYu0NqOJ3jeSVBRjsmX4OXMgWC-YGb7PS7DHGbYQ3VKiotOxoCwb0QAvD_BwE

 

 

[Shawn Sampson]

1st thanks for the support and We really appreciate it!

 

Hi Wes, 30 yrs ago I was in the same boat...

 

Really depends on your budget?

 

If you are looking for 100% coverage (at every track in the US) and perfect clear communications, go with digital radios and S9 in helmet and crew Mics.

https://www.sampsonracing.com/Digital-Starter-5watt-Package-for-2way-complete-p/digital-starter-package.htm

 

If your budget is limited but you want good quality then go with analog radios, add a roof mount antenna and good quality in helmet and crew headset (again with S9 mics).

https://www.sampsonracing.com/The-Expert-5watt-Package-for-2way-driver-to-crew-p/the-expert.htm

 

 and yes, you get a 15% Discount. 

 

Hope this helps...

 

Cheers, Shawn

Edited November 15, 2018 by Shawn Sampson

[Shawn Sampson]

3 hours ago, tneker said:

 

@snowman what is the biggest track you have had success on?  The biggest track we run is Road America, if we could have reasonable success there for this price range, we may actually finally pull the trigger on radios.

 You would have to run a roof mount antenna and make sure your install is correct (see video install in link) 100% coverage is not a issue but static at some points on the track might be.

https://www.sampsonracing.com/Shark-Fin-Phantom-Elite-Antenna-Coax-for-Racing-p/phantom-standard-system.htm

 

Yes, “reasonable success” you will get and much better than that

 

Cheers, Shawn

Edited November 15, 2018 by Shawn Sampson

[Shawn Sampson]

2 hours ago, MoparBoyy said:

Baofeng radios.  Google them, they are who make Rugged Radio radios.  you can get them for like $34 each.  get one driver headset and the pits dont need anything.  DONE.

 

https://www.walmart.com/ip/BAOFENG-BF-F8HP-Professoonal-128-Memory-Channels-Dual-Band-Handheld-Transceiver/454214556?wmlspartner=wlpa&selectedSellerId=101001044&adid=22222222227107376861&wl0=&wl1=g&wl2=c&wl3=235254844212&wl4=pla-416445457084&wl5=9011756&wl6=&wl7=&wl8=&wl9=pla&wl10=126804364&wl11=online&wl12=454214556&wl13=&veh=sem&gclid=CjwKCAiArK_fBRABEiwA0gOOc8NkagMYu0NqOJ3jeSVBRjsmX4OXMgWC-YGb7PS7DHGbYQ3VKiotOxoCwb0QAvD_BwE

 

 

Few note:

Make sure to only run UHF not VHF freq.

make sure to not just use cheap mics or without noise cancelling (way to much noise to driver)

use the correct roof mount antenna (uhf vs vhf)

DO NOT... just add a freq to your radio, it could be a masive issue with law enforcement or safety services in the area ( real issue for the day of racing and the organization)

 

Hope this helps

[snowman]

11 hours ago, tneker said:

 

@snowman what is the biggest track you have had success on?  The biggest track we run is Road America, if we could have reasonable success there for this price range, we may actually finally pull the trigger on radios.

 

VIR North was probably the longest, and some elevation changes.  Clear communication on every part of the track.  Road America might require a better antenna, but I don't think they are that much more expensive.  I think you could have reasonable success though.  You may have some trouble in the carousel and the kink.

 

I did buy a couple Baofeng radios off Amazon for crew members ,and programmed them to the channels included with my purchase from Sampson.  I do agree with his comment on the mic though.  A bad mic is just as, if not more frustrating than no mic.

 

Its a big nut to spend, I know.  But the system I got could not have been easier to set up, it was literally plug and play.  In less than an hour we were driving around my neighborhood pretending we were in Smokey and the Bandit (hence the Snowman handle).   

[Shawn Sampson]

BTW - we have a fantastic sale going on right now for digital radios - no discount codes on this special

 

[mcoppola]

12 hours ago, Shawn Sampson said:

1st thanks for the support and We really appreciate it!

 

Hi Wes, 30 yrs ago I was in the same boat...

 

Really depends on your budget?

 

If you are looking for 100% coverage (at every track in the US) and perfect clear communications, go with digital radios and S9 in helmet and crew Mics.

https://www.sampsonracing.com/Digital-Starter-5watt-Package-for-2way-complete-p/digital-starter-package.htm

 

If your budget is limited but you want good quality then go with analog radios, add a roof mount antenna and good quality in helmet and crew headset (again with S9 mics).

https://www.sampsonracing.com/The-Expert-5watt-Package-for-2way-driver-to-crew-p/the-expert.htm

 

 and yes, you get a 15% Discount. 

 

Hope this helps...

 

Cheers, Shawn

 

I'm glad to see @Shawn Sampson jumped in on this thread and offered advice and support. We are using 1 of the Sampson Digital Starter packages, and can't say enough good things about it. I've done a couple write-ups that are nearly a year old by now praising the system, Shawn's (& Ben's) technical expertise, and SRC's support of our series.

It's great to hear that SRC is STILL offering a 15% DISCOUNT to Champcar! I'm curious Shawn, would a Champcar team be able to apply the 15% discount to the base price ($899) of the digital starter system, or is the already discounted price of $855 the lowest that system can be purchased for?

[Shawn Sampson]

16 minutes ago, mcoppola said:

 

I'm glad to see @Shawn Sampson jumped in on this thread and offered advice and support. We are using 1 of the Sampson Digital Starter packages, and can't say enough good things about it. I've done a couple write-ups that are nearly a year old by now praising the system, Shawn's (& Ben's) technical expertise, and SRC's support of our series.

It's great to hear that SRC is STILL offering a 15% DISCOUNT to Champcar! I'm curious Shawn, would a Champcar team be able to apply the 15% discount to the base price ($899) of the digital starter system, or is the already discounted price of $855 the lowest that system can be purchased for?

Hi Mike - Thanks!

Yes we will honor the 15% discount to the sale price of $855 - So with discount it would be $726.75 and free shipping

https://www.sampsonracing.com/Digital-Starter-5watt-Package-for-2way-complete-p/digital-starter-package.htm

 

Edited November 15, 2018 by Shawn Sampson

[mcoppola]

@StuPDazzo and @tneker or anyone else thinking about buying radios.

Check out the deal above. For $726, you won't regret this decision - EVER! Your radio choice issues will be a thing of the past.

We are thinking about expanding our system by purchasing a mobile unit to go with the 2 handhelds, or another handheld with an antenna for the car, even though we have had no issues with full track, crystal clear communication at Mid Ohio and Road America.   An extra bonus to buying with Sampson is dealing directly with Shawn or Ben, who are both very knowledgeable and helpful when it comes to giving you answers and advice. They are much more interested in making sure you're well set up and happy, than trying to sell you something you might not really need. His recommendation of the digital system is not meant to sell something more expensive, it's because it's really that good! And if you opt for any of their analog systems, they will set you up with the correct antenna and installation instructions to make it work! 

Edited November 15, 2018 by mcoppola

[mpact]

I couldn't find the discount code for the online store and the ChampCar 15%. Do i need to call in for that? Thanks!

 

[snowman]

7 hours ago, mpact said:

I couldn't find the discount code for the online store and the ChampCar 15%. Do i need to call in for that? Thanks!

 

 

Try this......Chump15

[zack_280]

@StuPDazzo If you are buying new radios, I'd strongly consider digital.  They are not absolutely necessary, but it is very nice to have.  It really helps get clear communications between the driver and the crew especially on longer tracks.  

 

I replaced an older analog set that got stolen with digital motorolas and we have clear communication on 100% of the track at Road Atlanta.  With the analogs (Motorola SP50), we would get too much static from T6 to T9 (about 1/3 of the track) to have a chance at meaningful comms.  The analogs did work pretty well at Sebring, Daytona, Barber, and NCM.

[thewheelerZ]

^^^ I agree with these guys.  For the cost upgrade at the time of purchase its probably worth going digital.  We have analog and they work well.  But at the far corners of bigger tracks they get static-y and/or no comms at all.  (Mosport in T5, Calabogie most of the back side, Watkins down in the boot).  If I were to be buying new, id probably just try to stretch for the better radios.

[bbaker480]

I know this was mentioned a few different ways above but I wanted to make sure it isn't missed.  If you are running an external antenna make sure it is properly installed.  We dropped the cash to upgrade to a Vertex digital setup and it was fantastic the first day out but at the next race just wasn't working at all.  We tried everything ane eventally reached out to Shawn who suggested we try putting the ducky antenna back on and giving that a shot which of course seems to have been the problem all along.  

[Shawn Sampson]

Check the video link on this page. The video is about 3yrs old (shows the Vertex EVX radios - now Motorola EVX Radios). 

https://www.sampsonracing.com/Digital-Expert-5watt-Package-for-2way-complete-p/digital-expert-package.htm

 

As a driver it amazing to have full communications at tracks that have always been hit or miss at some sections. 

 

[StuPDazzo]

Wow, I really appreciate all the replies and info, this is really helpful!  I think it's time to pull the trigger and buy the legit system from Shawn, especially with the sale going on - and y'all have convinced me that digital is the way to go.  Imagine that, actually being able to talk to the car during the race, what a concept!

 

Now all I have to do is get the boys to pony up some cash - wish me luck! 

[epic_garage]

We have been using a free app called Zello installed on our cell phone in the car (runs the background with speedfreq), its hard wired to a cheapy set of headphones with mic, Also wired in a button to the steering wheel for ptt. Its a little clunky at times, I can provide more info if your interested...