Driver's Championship

[mender]

Presently there's no way to separate a team's driving abilities from the car's performance. I'm thinking of a way to do that.

 

Petition:

 

There are apparently distinct discrepancies in the driving abilities of the various teams and also the performance potential of the cars. In order to provide a more even and representative outcome in the Championship races held at the end of each year, I petition the BoD, TAC and CEO to more evenly distribute the driving talents by allowing the teams with poor drivers but exceptional cars to have drivers from teams with exceptional drivers but poor cars swap places. 

 

Format: each team that qualifies for the Championship will submit a roster of 4 drivers from which 2 drivers will be selected to exchange seats with another team. The laps completed during the exchange stints will be scored to the original teams and tallied at the end of the race to determine the overall winners. All stints must be of equal duration.

 

Example: Team A scores 56 laps with their own driver, 61 laps with a "guest" driver, 58 with their own second driver and 59 with the second guest driver. Team B who is swapping drivers with Team A scores 61 laps with their own driver, 58 laps with a guest driver, 62 laps with their own second driver and 57 laps with the second guest driver.

 

Total laps for Team A: 56 + 58 + 58 + 57 = 229 laps

Total laps for Team B: 61 + 61 + 62 + 59 = 243 laps

 

Since the teams have equal time in each car, Team B is obviously the better team and rightfully wins the Championship.

[Chris Huggins]

LOL at the above - As a driver and a owner, I will absolutely NOT let just anyone into my car, and I will absolutely NOT get into certain cars (Liability and Safety standpoints).  That opens up a HUUGE can of worms.

 

Not exactly what you wanted with the above, but:

It would be cool to track drivers like AER does.  Its something we could work towards over time.  We could also have a "drivers championship" by saying the best X finishes wins, say the drivers 4 best race finishes, and the lowest points win. 

 

[mender]

1 minute ago, Huggy said:

LOL at the above - As a driver and a owner, I will absolutely NOT let just anyone into my car, and I will absolutely NOT get into certain cars (Liability and Safety standpoints).  That opens up a HUUGE can of worms.

 

Not exactly what you wanted with the above, but:

It would be cool to track drivers like AER does.  Its something we could work towards over time.  We could also have a "drivers championship" by saying the best X finishes wins, say the drivers 4 best race finishes, and the lowest points win. 

But these are all championship teams with proven cars that have passed tech numerous times and drivers that have shown their worth, surely your objections are not warranted?

 

Just think of them as arrive and drive but of a known and superior quality. It's definitely in their best interest to take care of your equipment because the Championship depends on them getting a good result.

[Team Infiniti]

15 minutes ago, mender said:

by allowing the teams with poor drivers but exceptional cars to have drivers from teams with exceptional drivers but poor cars swap places. 

Why?

Want a championship team you better put together a complete championship package!

 

Insert "Everyone gets a trophy" meme

[Team Infiniti]

21 minutes ago, mender said:

But these are all championship teams with proven cars that have passed tech numerous times and drivers that have shown their worth

Your words  " all championship teams"  not "Some random championship drivers on teams that have made it this far"

 

Cant have good drivers in non running cars I want a championship mechanic award to be issued to the best, most reliable car 

Wheres my gold star?

 

Edited November 15, 2018 by Team Infiniti

[Chris Huggins]

30 minutes ago, mender said:

But these are all championship teams with proven cars that have passed tech numerous times and drivers that have shown their worth, surely your objections are not warranted?

 

Just think of them as arrive and drive but of a known and superior quality. It's definitely in their best interest to take care of your equipment because the Championship depends on them getting a good result.

 

Not sure if you are serious and *obtuse* or trolling?  You have to be trolling.

 

In case you aren't:

 

Tech doesn't inspect for safety to my standards. Mine are much higher than the minimum required by tech.  Tech does also not inspect for build quality, maintenance, etc.  If I am spending my hard earned money to race, im going to race.  I will not show up hoping to drive.  I do not enjoy working on cars in the parking lot of a race track with race noises in the background.  If I come to a race and never even unlock the toolbox, I did my job as a builder well. That is the goal.

 

Also, I don't do arrive-and-drive.  I just don't do it. I only put drivers in my car who are known and superior in quality, take care of equipment, can afford to fix things if they go wrong, will do the right thing if things go wrong without me having to chase them down, and get along with the team.  

 

You knew all that already though.  

[mcoppola]

@Team Infiniti

Ed, if we ever meet, I'll give you a gold star for (most) always being sensible in your posts and adhering to rule evolutions without a whole lot of drama.

We could call it the 'grateful, happy participant' award.

Edited November 15, 2018 by mcoppola

[Team Infiniti]

Im content with our Chandler

[mender]

13 minutes ago, Huggy said:

 

Not sure if you are serious and *obtuse* or trolling?  You have to be trolling.

 

In case you aren't:

 

Tech doesn't inspect for safety to my standards. Mine are much higher than the minimum required by tech.  Tech does also not inspect for build quality, maintenance, etc.  If I am spending my hard earned money to race, im going to race.  I will not show up hoping to drive.  I do not enjoy working on cars in the parking lot of a race track with race noises in the background.  If I come to a race and never even unlock the toolbox, I did my job as a builder well. That is the goal.

 

Also, I don't do arrive-and-drive.  I just don't do it. I only put drivers in my car who are known and superior in quality, take care of equipment, can afford to fix things if they go wrong, will do the right thing if things go wrong without me having to chase them down, and get along with the team.  

 

You knew all that already though.  

As you suspect, this is mostly tongue in cheek, and I agree with you on all points.

 

The "mostly" however leaves room for a like-minded team to have some fun ...

[Ray Franck]

Mender. Slow day not much to do ?

[MoparBoyy]

Even as the owner of a for rent car, i'm still very leary about who we let into the rental car and a very solid contract must be signed.   We would also never in a million years let someone in the Cobra.

 

If you want a driver championship.. do it in rental go-karts

[mender]

6 minutes ago, Ray Franck said:

Mender. Slow day not much to do ?

Having lunch and waiting for parts.

[mender]

6 minutes ago, MoparBoyy said:

Even as the owner of a for rent car, i'm still very leary about who we let into the rental car and a very solid contract must be signed.   We would also never in a million years let someone in the Cobra.

 

If you want a driver championship.. do it in rental go-karts

Sounds like everyone who could be expected to be in the Championship has the same standards, so it shouldn't be a problem.

 

Are you saying you wouldn't let Huggy drive your car?

[MoparBoyy]

1 minute ago, mender said:

Are you saying you wouldn't let Huggy drive your car?

 

correct.

[Wink]

This is ridiculous. This is a team sport, from building to driving. 

[riche30]

As a team owner, never happening.  I'm not letting someone in my car just because their team qualified for a championship.  A good team can carry a bad driver.

As a Board of Directors member.. what a nightmare this is from a liability standpoint.  What if that loaned person totals YOUR car?

[mender]

2 hours ago, riche30 said:

As a team owner, never happening.  I'm not letting someone in my car just because their team qualified for a championship.  A good team can carry a bad driver.

As a Board of Directors member.. what a nightmare this is from a liability standpoint.  What if that loaned person totals YOUR car?

As I said, no different than an arrive and drive.

 

Kind of funny how everybody thinks that they're the only ones good enough to drive their car. I guess that explains why everyone thinks they're a good driver in a bad car and everybody else is a bad driver in a good car.  

Edited November 16, 2018 by mender

[Racer28173]

Absolutely not!!!  Anything that puts me at risk of having to drive the same car as @Wyatt is unacceptable.  I am still recovering from the last time that happened.

[MoparBoyy]

11 hours ago, mender said:

Kind of funny how everybody thinks that they're the only ones good enough to drive their car. I guess that explains why everyone thinks they're a good driver in a bad car and everybody else is a bad driver in a good car.  

 

Not even close. I'm the one who spent a year building the car, not just handing it over to someone just because they race in the same series as me.

 

I would also not let anyone come over and f*ck my wife.. personal preference i guess. 

 

[bendawson3]

I'd be on this like a hobo on a ham sandwich, @mender

 

Sounds like a fun thing that we should immediately mandate. Man, that would be fun/funny

 

Everybody else should calm down and get creative at their lunch, too. This racing key party idea could just be the start to some really freaky stuff up in the chump world

[Black Magic]

Taking this in a different direction, it would be interesting to have a "benchmarking" event where the same driver or select few drivers turns several laps in a bunch of different cars to see what they can do. I have had a chance to drive some interesting cars, and it gives you a better perspective of what different types of cars are up against. Sort of learned how much harder the neon has to be driven to match the speed of some other cars that drive at lower % of peak, but how much easier it is to get to that higher level in some cars. 

 

Might need to be a "gentleman's" agreement, where the owners of the cars swap among each other so we all have skin in the game. This sort of happens for the top teams already, but would be interesting to do it after a race for an hour or two assuming we still had access to the track. 

[E. Tyler Pedersen]

13 minutes ago, Black Magic said:

Taking this in a different direction, it would be interesting to have a "benchmarking" event where the same driver or select few drivers turns several laps in a bunch of different cars to see what they can do. I have had a chance to drive some interesting cars, and it gives you a better perspective of what different types of cars are up against. Sort of learned how much harder the neon has to be driven to match the speed of some other cars that drive at lower % of peak, but how much easier it is to get to that higher level in some cars. 

 

Might need to be a "gentleman's" agreement, where the owners of the cars swap among each other so we all have skin in the game. This sort of happens for the top teams already, but would be interesting to do it after a race for an hour or two assuming we still had access to the track. 

 

One Solution: Randy Pobst

[Rodger Coan-Burningham]

13 hours ago, Racer28173 said:

Absolutely not!!!  Anything that puts me at risk of having to drive the same car as @Wyatt is unacceptable.  I am still recovering from the last time that happened.

 

Trufe!  You are forced to come up with several excuses when you drive with him.  I just always stick with the standard line that I couldn't get a clean lap.

[mender]

1 hour ago, MoparBoyy said:

Not even close. I'm the one who spent a year building the car, not just handing it over to someone just because they race in the same series as me.

Don't forget that you'd be driving their car too.

 

But I get it, it wouldn't be easy for me to let other drivers hop in my Fiero and push it hard. So far I've only had five other drivers besides myself in the car. Two of them were faster than me (I'm decent but old), one should have been faster but instead hit 2nd instead of 4th (7600 rpm!) and spun the car into a gravel trap where he fried the clutch trying to get out , one was only a bit slower than me (being respectful of my equipment) and the other two were teammates that were 3 and 5 seconds slower. Half the drivers that get in the car spin it so a concern about that for sure. Again, there's good reason why mid-engine teams ask for mid-engine experience.

 

That being said, there are a few drivers here that seem to have pretty solid credentials (Wyatt's name comes up frequently) that I'm pretty sure would acquit themselves well. And yes, Randy Pobst! 

 

No problem with the Civic though, it's quite easy to drive and apparently pretty tough. It's a car that seems to invite hard driving. Nobody seems to require FWD experience.

[enginerd]

All of this driver vs. car information gathering can be done on the (fairly common) Friday test days. I think it’s a fantastic idea to have my top competitors jump in each other’s cars and wring the snot out of them for bragging rights a day before the race.