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Team Infiniti

V6 e30 Quasi Build Thread

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3 minutes ago, Team Infiniti said:

As noted in another thread, picked up a perfect gas tank from another champ at Road Atlanta, then,  yesterday, went to visit our new sponsor@  U Pull and Pay for a tank unit. Still hunting for a couple of 16 gal gas gauges.  Anyone here? 

 

Since the race I’ve been thinking about a couple things:

 

1) Alternate engine selection more closely matching  The Not Bannd Yet team, this would give me a  substantially lighter engine but less power but with a little more wiggle room in the swap calculator...with that engine  comes a bittersweet five speed automatic paddle shift transmission option , I see them fail on the street quite often, not sure if they are up to it. Going to have to talk to that automatic Nissan 350 Z that showed up and didn’t finish.

 

2: Same engine as above but with an adapter to stock getrag BMW five speed.  This option leaves me with 500 points, unfortunately, with 30 minutes of Internet shopping I have not found an adapter, either have to dig harder or do some mock up work to see what it’s going to take.

 

 With option #2 in mind, I have a question for everyone, What is the approximate shift & maximum RPM for swapped and unswapped  e30s? 

I think most teams running M20s are shifting around 6500. Not making much extra power past 6000.

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10 minutes ago, mindspin311 said:

I think most teams running M20s are shifting around 6500. Not making much extra power past 6000.

I haven't seen much power over about 5400 rpm from an m20.

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54 minutes ago, wvumtnbkr said:

I haven't seen much power over about 5400 rpm from an m20.

But isn't there quite a bit of area under the curve from 5400 to 6500?    Not saying it isn't smart to shift somewhere in there.   (below 6500)

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1 hour ago, Team Infiniti said:

As noted in another thread, picked up a perfect gas tank from another champ at Road Atlanta, then,  yesterday, went to visit our new sponsor@  U Pull and Pay for a tank unit. Still hunting for a couple of 16 gal gas gauges.  Anyone here? 

 

 

you mean sending units?

 

Early and late sending units are identical.  Each is 0-60 ohm

 

Late gauge clusters had a 120ohm gauge.  The sending units were wired in series,

Early gauge clusters had a 60 ohm gauge.  There was only one sending unit.

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26 minutes ago, Huggy said:

you mean sending units?

Yes, I thought early and late were different length, also, I was thinking right and left gauges rather then a average.

Edited by Team Infiniti

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3 minutes ago, Team Infiniti said:

Yes, I thought early and late were different length.

The passenger side of the tank did not change. The late models came with the drivers side expanded and the crossover tube was eliminated from the bottom of tank. Late model also had another sending unit incorporated which is why they became 120 ohm gauges.

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7 minutes ago, jakks said:

The passenger side of the tank did not change. The late models came with the drivers side expanded and the crossover tube was eliminated from the bottom of tank. Late model also had another sending unit incorporated which is why they became 120 ohm gauges.

Ok, let me get this straight, the early tanks are the same depth as late *on both sides*? There is only one size sending unit on ALL e30s?

 

As of right now, aside from the tank bought @ Rd. Atl,  all my spare parts are 84 and 86 based

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Wheel question

 

What will fit without adapters?

 

15X8
4X100
35mm offset


OR

 

* 15x8 4x100
* +25 offset

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I've heard from some of my E30 buds that the typical 35-36mm Miata offset will require spacers to avoid the inside of the wheel contacting the suspension bits.

Backspacing is a better number for comparison, because it doesn't change with different wheel widths. offset numbers change per width of the wheel.

I'll see if I can find a handy chart I have that shows the BS for each offset/width of wheel.

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And for the moment we are on the same path with a heavy vg30, the van full of parts kind of dictates this direction.

 

 

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Darn, I'm having a hard time attaching the offset/BS chart, but as a rule of thumb follow this:

A typical wheel will have 1/2" of bead width, inner and outer, whether constructed of aluminum or steel.

So, for a 8" wide rim with a 25mm (approx. 1") offset, here's how to find the backspace. 

8" + 0.5" + 0.5" = 9.0" overall. The midpoint of the rim (zero offset) would be 4.5" measured from either bead, inner or outer.

So the backspacing of an 8" wide rim with 25mm offset would be approx. 5.5"

Ed, my advice:

Take any rim that fits on the car with a 4x100 PCD (bolt pattern), and measure the backspace by placing a straight edge across the inside bead. Measure down to the hub flange to get the backspace number. Now put the rim on the car and measure how much clearance there is between the inside bead and whatever it might hit (usually strut, or other susp bits...) 

Once you know how much backspace your car can accept, you can easily translate backspace to offset numbers for differing wheel widths by using the method I described above.

Edited by mcoppola
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Take this as a compliment...

 

You are like the Dave morrow (from lemons) of champcar.

 

Always thinking outside the box and never going down the easy path.  Great attitude and competitive!

 

If you don't know who he is, Google him and his team.  Great guy!

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3 hours ago, Team Infiniti said:

As noted in another thread, picked up a perfect gas tank from another champ at Road Atlanta, then,  yesterday, went to visit our new sponsor@  U Pull and Pay for a tank unit. Still hunting for a couple of 16 gal gas gauges.  Anyone here? 

 

Since the race I’ve been thinking about a couple things:

 

1) Alternate engine selection more closely matching  The Not Bannd Yet team, this would give me a  substantially lighter engine but less power but with a little more wiggle room in the swap calculator...with that engine  comes a bittersweet five speed automatic paddle shift transmission option , I see them fail on the street quite often, not sure if they are up to it. Going to have to talk to that automatic Nissan 350 Z that showed up and didn’t finish.

 

2: Same engine as above but with an adapter to stock getrag BMW five speed.  This option leaves me with 500 points, unfortunately, with 30 minutes of Internet shopping I have not found an adapter, either have to dig harder or do some mock up work to see what it’s going to take.

 

 With option #2 in mind, I have a question for everyone, What is the approximate shift & maximum RPM for swapped and unswapped  e30s? 

2:  If you are ditching the automatic then you might as well run a BMW M50 engine. It’s been done a thousand times, doesn’t require an adapter, hella reliable, etc. 

It’s also boring compared to biggerpower + automatic. That is unique.

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26 minutes ago, enginerd said:

2:  If you are ditching the automatic then you might as well run a BMW M50 engine. It’s been done a thousand times, doesn’t require an adapter, hella reliable, etc. 

It’s also boring compared to biggerpower + automatic. That is unique.

"It’s been done a thousand times" has no appeal in this camp, none of us here are considered normal 🙃

 

There here is only ONE unlikely reason this build could ever end up with BMW power, if its *too fast* and gets culled by future BCCR "enhancements". It should be spiffy potent but not likely to get the ban hammer with a heavy, dated power plant.

 

 

Edited by Team Infiniti
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remember that one time at bandcamp when the weight of the E30 was magically changed just exactly so you could run an M50 in the E30?  😛

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4 hours ago, Team Infiniti said:

Ok, let me get this straight, the early tanks are the same depth as late *on both sides*? There is only one size sending unit on ALL e30s?

 

As of right now, aside from the tank bought @ Rd. Atl,  all my spare parts are 84 and 86 based

No, the late model is expanded out towards the frame and also is deeper. If you look on the early model cars they have an pump and fuel filter mounted between the tank and the frame, righ near the rear subframe mounting bolt. The extra 2 gallons came from this expansion. Sending unit for the drivers side is completely different than the passenger side because it doesn't have a fuel pickup.

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8 minutes ago, jakks said:

Sending unit for the drivers side is completely different than the passenger side because it doesn't have a fuel pickup.

As of right now, I have the fuel pump and hanger from the big tank minus sender and the sending unit/ pump complete from the small tank, I can rob another small tank for its level gauge to plug the hole but at some point on the build I was hoping to have enough parts to create accurate fuel gauge(s)

 

At this moment, the plan is to make all pumps external as to eek out every ounce of fuel volume.

Edited by Team Infiniti

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12 minutes ago, mender said:

Don't you have a fuel cell in that shed?

Nope, not to mention the disturbance in the force when moving fuel from under the rear seat to the trunk.

 

Oh

 

Going to need the extra 6 gallons the stock tank will be asked to hold :ph34r:

Edited by Team Infiniti
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 All the previous talk about the roll cage was fine and dandy, paid for and all, but it hadn’t been picked up yet,  with the seller a little flaky and it four hours away, I was a little anxious... no longer, Justin9  picked it up a short time ago, it will be stored safely until an excuse to travel or Daytona race,  where we can get up there and fetch.

 

 

Edited by Team Infiniti
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On 2/12/2019 at 9:26 AM, Team Infiniti said:

Ok, let me get this straight, the early tanks are the same depth as late *on both sides*? There is only one size sending unit on ALL e30s?

 

As of right now, aside from the tank bought @ Rd. Atl,  all my spare parts are 84 and 86 based

No the early tanks are shallower on the drivers side and have a capacity of 14.7 gallons. the late model tanks are same depth both sides and have a capacity of 16.6

Edited by atxe30

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1 minute ago, atxe30 said:

No the early tanks are shallower on the drivers side and have a capacity of 14.7 gallons. the late model tanks are same depth and have a capacity of 16.6

As of this moment I have 2 fuel gauge units from early tanks, is there a late variant that is longer and bolts in?

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there were some threads on r3vlimited discussing the "right" way to do the fuel system for e30 endurance setup. basically i built my system off of that guidance with a few tweaks. 

 

i retained the in-tank pump housings with the fuel level sending units but removed the in-tank pumps. Now they just serve as a mount for pick-up tube. The carter marine pumps in the trunk lift from the oem tank to the surge tank. having everything in the trunk makes servicing much easier and the carter pumps are way cheaper than oem replacement pumps. also the setup i have is the only way to suck the oem tank dry as far as i could tell from other folks.

Edited by atxe30

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1 minute ago, Team Infiniti said:

As of this moment I have 2 fuel gauge units from early tanks, is there a late variant that is longer and bolts in?

All passenger side fuel sending units are the same, regardless of year model.

These are the ones that go into the fuel pump hanger.

 

The driver side fuel sending units on late model tanks are stand alone and are not mounted with a fuel pump.

 

Driver side:

https://www.fcpeuro.com/products/bmw-fuel-tank-sending-unit-16141179720

 

Passenger side 

https://www.fcpeuro.com/products/bmw-fuel-tank-sending-unit-16141152266-1

 

 

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