wvumtnbkr Posted July 31, 2019 Report Share Posted July 31, 2019 (edited) Okay, this is the first post in my new build thread. Some of you know 556 met her demise at Charlotte during the championship. She did not survive. I can not rebuild her.... sorta. I decided to strip all the useful parts (read: cheaty) off the car to use on the new chassis. I got a new chassis. Same year. It's a rolling chassis in decent shape with crappy paint applied. I have the old drivetrain that came out. Seems it survived the accident and the fire mostly unscathed (aside from the wiring harness). Here is my first question to the group.... Which engine should I put in it? All use the same trans and drivetrain. 1) 3400 gm v6 Pros: Engine I have. Cons:152 whp. 2)3500 gm v6 Pros: probably 170 whp. Cheap to buy. Cons: need a throttle body adapter, and about 250$ in sensor and wiring 3)3800 gm v6 Pros: probably 173whp. Can get all from 1 donor Cons: reliability? Need new everything. What say you? Pics to be added later. Edited July 31, 2019 by wvumtnbkr Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hayne Posted July 31, 2019 Report Share Posted July 31, 2019 3800 from V6 Camaro or Firebird. with T5. yank a harness. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Team Infiniti Posted July 31, 2019 Report Share Posted July 31, 2019 27 minutes ago, wvumtnbkr said: Pros: probably 170 whp. Cheap to buy. Cons: need a throttle body adapter, and about 250$ in sensor and wiring This, mostly the same as you already have but more powah, 250$ is squat when rebuilding from this sort of crash. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
karman1970 Posted July 31, 2019 Report Share Posted July 31, 2019 I'm assuming you've already run the numbers and have enough points to play with for all possible combinations... 3800. They made gazillions of them and they sell for pennies. No personal experience with them other than the half dozen Impalas, Buicks, and Monte Carlos my dad has racked up the miles on, but supposedly one of the more reliable GM motors in the Fruity series. If I was being OCD about weight, maybe the 3500. They made two different flavors - one is a bored out 3400, the other is a destroked 3.9. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Team Infiniti Posted July 31, 2019 Report Share Posted July 31, 2019 (edited) For an entire book full of mechanics excuses I went through (4) NA 3800 series 2 in a 98 Monte Carlo over 33k miles., Street only... I currently have a super charged 3800 which has been rock solid Edited July 31, 2019 by Team Infiniti Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Black Magic Posted July 31, 2019 Report Share Posted July 31, 2019 What are engine weights for these? Point for each swap? A cam could awaken the slumber most of these low turning gm v6's have.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snorman Posted July 31, 2019 Report Share Posted July 31, 2019 2 minutes ago, Team Infiniti said: I currently have a super charged 3800 which has been rock solid OMG...one of the supercharged 3800's would be awesome. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fitsbain Posted July 31, 2019 Report Share Posted July 31, 2019 Rob - A common friend of ours with a certain furry gremlin, has (I believe) a few GTP motors. Don't think he was planning to use them any more. One of them came out of the furry car. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fitsbain Posted July 31, 2019 Report Share Posted July 31, 2019 1 hour ago, wvumtnbkr said: Okay, this is the first post in my new build thread. Some of you know 556 met her demise at Charlotte during the championship. She did not survive. I can not rebuild her.... sorta. I decided to strip all the useful parts (read: cheaty) off the car to use on the new chassis. I got a new chassis. Same year. It's a rolling chassis in decent shape with crappy paint applied. This the one from Ohio? Now I have to come all the way down there to cut your fenders!! 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Team Infiniti Posted July 31, 2019 Report Share Posted July 31, 2019 (edited) 15 minutes ago, Snorman said: OMG...one of the supercharged 3800's would be awesome. If your former furry motor friend doesn’t pan out I have an entire GTP supercharged donor car... Saying that, they are quite a bit heavier than a 34 or 3500 Edited July 31, 2019 by Team Infiniti Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wvumtnbkr Posted July 31, 2019 Author Report Share Posted July 31, 2019 Good stuff. Thanks for the replies. The 3400 has been bulletproof. The 3500 is supposed to be a bit more reliable due to gasket and sealing surface improvements. I am looking at the non vvt 3500, which as stated is a bigger 3400. It is the lx9 engine which @mender has run. He has been very helpful throughout the 3400 swap and through where to go from here. It would be much simpler if the 3500 ecu was tunable. As it is, I need to run the 3400 ecu, 3400 wiring harness, 3500 injectors, get a different fuel pressure regulator, and figure out how to make the engine cable throttle body instead of dbw. Oh, and get a new type crank sensor and mount. The 3800 doesn't need any of that stuff figured out. Just transplant and go. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
enginerd Posted July 31, 2019 Report Share Posted July 31, 2019 (edited) 4 minutes ago, wvumtnbkr said: Good stuff. Thanks for the replies. The 3400 has been bulletproof. The 3500 is supposed to be a bit more reliable due to gasket and sealing surface improvements. I am looking at the non vvt 3500, which as stated is a bigger 3400. It is the lx9 engine which @mender has run. He has been very helpful throughout the 3400 swap and through where to go from here. It would be much simpler if the 3500 ecu was tunable. As it is, I need to run the 3400 ecu, 3400 wiring harness, 3500 injectors, get a different fuel pressure regulator, and figure out how to make the engine cable throttle body instead of dbw. Oh, and get a new type crank sensor and mount. The 3800 doesn't need any of that stuff figured out. Just transplant and go. Do you have engine bay space / swap points for a BMW 2.5L m54 engine? Should make about 180 to the wheels? Edited July 31, 2019 by enginerd 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wvumtnbkr Posted July 31, 2019 Author Report Share Posted July 31, 2019 (edited) I have the room, but one of the reasons I went with this group of engines is cost. You can buy them at any junkyard anywhere in the country for 2 to 300$ for a running engine. A full rebuild is still less than 1k including machine work if necessary. I put about $200 into the rebuild to make it 100% reliable over the last 3 years. (Gaskets and water pump before it went in the car) Edited July 31, 2019 by wvumtnbkr 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
karman1970 Posted July 31, 2019 Report Share Posted July 31, 2019 1 hour ago, Black Magic said: What are engine weights for these? Point for each swap? A cam could awaken the slumber most of these low turning gm v6's have.... 3800 weighs around 390 I think. Aluminum head 60 degree motors are in the 350 range. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FlorahDorah Posted July 31, 2019 Report Share Posted July 31, 2019 That first picture made me so sad... but the rest of the thread cheered me right up! 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Technical Advisory Committee mcoppola Posted July 31, 2019 Technical Advisory Committee Report Share Posted July 31, 2019 1 hour ago, FlorahDorah said: That first picture made me so sad... but the rest of the thread cheered me right up! Yes that first picture was a sad one... I'll always remember that car in the Gingerman race when Eric was trying to hold off GWR in the closing laps with no brakes left. Seeing him plow through the sand trap and come out still fighting was pretty awesome. I predicted that car was going to one to reckon with when @wvumtnbkr first did the GM V6 swap. I'm predicting this build is gonna be even faster this time around. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jab31169 Posted July 31, 2019 Report Share Posted July 31, 2019 Honest question because I'm an idiot, why not the 4.3 LU3? I'm guessing the same reason being cost?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wvumtnbkr Posted July 31, 2019 Author Report Share Posted July 31, 2019 1 hour ago, Jab31169 said: Honest question because I'm an idiot, why not the 4.3 LU3? I'm guessing the same reason being cost?? Don't know? Because sbc aren't known for reliability in this setting? Got more research to do.... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mender Posted August 1, 2019 Report Share Posted August 1, 2019 4 hours ago, karman1970 said: 3800 weighs around 390 I think. Aluminum head 60 degree motors are in the 350 range. 211 hp (LZ4) = 64 points. Overkill used to support them but I just checked, no longer. 3800 and 4.3 are 90 degree V6s and are wider than the high value (3400-3900) engines. I did a moderate boost 4.3 (9 psi) using two Dodge 2.2 turbochargers that made 470 hp and 530 ft.lbs of torque on the engine dyno. Made 268 hp and 308 ft.lbs before adding boost. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mender Posted August 1, 2019 Report Share Posted August 1, 2019 (edited) 8 hours ago, wvumtnbkr said: I am looking at the non vvt 3500, which as stated is a bigger 3400. It is the lx9 engine which @mender has run. He has been very helpful throughout the 3400 swap and through where to go from here. It would be much simpler if the 3500 ecu was tunable. As it is, I need to run the 3400 ecu, 3400 wiring harness, 3500 injectors, get a different fuel pressure regulator, and figure out how to make the engine cable throttle body instead of dbw. Oh, and get a new type crank sensor and mount. My 186 whp (on the heartbreaker dyno) LX9 is available complete with harness, sensors and tuned ECU. Needs the timing chain replaced and new valve seals, leakdown is 4% on all cylinders after about 80 hrs of racing. Hook up a cable to the included throttle body and go. Cometic, ARP head studs and rod bolts, ported everything. Too bad you don't live closer. Edited August 1, 2019 by mender 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wvumtnbkr Posted August 1, 2019 Author Report Share Posted August 1, 2019 17 minutes ago, mender said: My 186 whp (on the heartbreaker dyno) LZ9 is available complete with harness, sensors and tuned ECU. Needs the timing chain replaced and new valve seals, leakdown is 4% on all cylinders after about 80 hrs of racing. Hook up a cable to the included throttle body and go. Cometic, ARP head studs and rod bolts, ported everything. Too bad you don't live closer. Message sent.... 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Black Magic Posted August 1, 2019 Report Share Posted August 1, 2019 10 hours ago, mender said: My 186 whp (on the heartbreaker dyno) LX9 is available complete with harness, sensors and tuned ECU. Needs the timing chain replaced and new valve seals, leakdown is 4% on all cylinders after about 80 hrs of racing. Hook up a cable to the included throttle body and go. Cometic, ARP head studs and rod bolts, ported everything. Too bad you don't live closer. Crate it and send business to business, grey hound, or some other national shipper. The rx7 is one of the few cars with the fuel to support it. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wvumtnbkr Posted August 1, 2019 Author Report Share Posted August 1, 2019 Especially with the s5 18.5 gallon tank! Anybody travelling from Alberta to south Carolina? Haha! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Black Magic Posted August 1, 2019 Report Share Posted August 1, 2019 8 minutes ago, wvumtnbkr said: Especially with the s5 18.5 gallon tank! Anybody travelling from Alberta to south Carolina? Haha! You are in SC now? We need to catch up then....Charlotte can't be that far, or a test day at CMP. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bbaker480 Posted August 1, 2019 Report Share Posted August 1, 2019 30 minutes ago, wvumtnbkr said: Especially with the s5 18.5 gallon tank! Anybody travelling from Alberta to south Carolina? Haha! I wonder if anybody is going to be at Gingerman from the great white north that at least could get it across the border and into your truck or Tyler's trailer? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.