67Mustang Posted August 30, 2019 Report Share Posted August 30, 2019 Am I correct in thinking that this main hoop would need replaced completely due to the hole where the door bar was attached? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mender Posted August 30, 2019 Report Share Posted August 30, 2019 Why was it removed? And where are you putting the replacement and what style? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
67Mustang Posted August 30, 2019 Author Report Share Posted August 30, 2019 Not my car, was just looking at it and considering what it might need to bring up to date. It's a 74 914..... I've got a couple of spare flat sixes because I seem to collect junk.... Even with the current swap rules, a 1971 2.2 911E engine at 155 hp would swap in for 68 points and that engine has the same heads, valves and forged crank as the S. Also has the Bosch MFI so you could go a couple of ways, home port the heads and use bigger cams, or...... for another 100 points,,,,, turbo that sucker.... just exploring and thinking. For the same money though you could build a lot of other stuff that would be pretty fast as well.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Black Magic Posted August 30, 2019 Report Share Posted August 30, 2019 (edited) Wait....so the main hoop was cut to place the door bar in it? Am I seeing that right? I would feel pretty sketchy about an interrupted (non continuous tube) for the main hoop. That is beyond the legality of it. You want the main hoop to be as strong an element as possible against buckling (roll over), and cutting it apart and putting another hollow element in the hoop isn't going to help that. If the hole is some remaining part of a door bar tube end, I have successfully ground down the weld\end of door bars. You need to be careful and don't grind into the main hoop, you want full cross section of the main hoop left when you are done (like nothing was ever welded to it). The main hoops I have cleaned up were very close to 1 3/4 OD after the grinding, I think within a tenth. Taking your time helps. (Edited to tenth....meaning .010, i wrote it as .100). Edited September 3, 2019 by Black Magic Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wvumtnbkr Posted August 30, 2019 Report Share Posted August 30, 2019 3 hours ago, Black Magic said: Wait....so the main hoop was cut to place the door bar in it? Am I seeing that right? I would feel pretty sketchy about an interrupted (non continuous tube) for the main hoop. That is beyond the legality of it. You want the main hoop to be as strong an element as possible against buckling (roll over), and cutting it apart and putting another hollow element in the hoop isn't going to help that. If the hole is some remaining part of a door bar tube end, I have successfully ground down the weld\end of door bars. You need to be careful and don't grind into the main hoop, you want full cross section of the main hoop left when you are done (like nothing was ever welded to it). The main hoops I have cleaned up were very close to 1 3/4 OD after the grinding, I think within a tenth of so of an inch. Taking your time helps. Uh, a tenth of an inch could be the entire wall if it is .095" 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TimS Posted August 30, 2019 Report Share Posted August 30, 2019 I would cut it out and start from scratch. Craftsmanship looks a bit sub par. When in doubt don't risk your life on a couple sticks of tubing. If the cage fits the car well it could be used as a template Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Indysupra Posted August 30, 2019 Report Share Posted August 30, 2019 Yea looks like it was welded with a torch and some coat hangers as filler rod. (Yes I have done it before lol) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bbaker480 Posted August 30, 2019 Report Share Posted August 30, 2019 3 hours ago, wvumtnbkr said: Uh, a tenth of an inch could be the entire wall if it is .095" Or double the thickness, I would be more comfortable with a flap wheel leaving what I know is the last of the weld as a bump than risking grinding into the tube. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ronh911 Posted August 31, 2019 Report Share Posted August 31, 2019 11 hours ago, 67Mustang said: Not my car, was just looking at it and considering what it might need to bring up to date. It's a 74 914..... I've got a couple of spare flat sixes because I seem to collect junk.... Even with the current swap rules, a 1971 2.2 911E engine at 155 hp would swap in for 68 points and that engine has the same heads, valves and forged crank as the S. Also has the Bosch MFI so you could go a couple of ways, home port the heads and use bigger cams, or...... for another 100 points,,,,, turbo that sucker.... just exploring and thinking. For the same money though you could build a lot of other stuff that would be pretty fast as well.... Don’t forget about the $2500 engine swap rule for next year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
67Mustang Posted August 31, 2019 Author Report Share Posted August 31, 2019 I hadn't seen that yet! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
karman1970 Posted August 31, 2019 Report Share Posted August 31, 2019 TDI swap, auto trans, bigger turbo, intercooler, points left over for aero and suspension. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mender Posted August 31, 2019 Report Share Posted August 31, 2019 3 hours ago, Ronh911 said: Don’t forget about the $2500 engine swap rule for next year. So much for limiting costs and speed creep. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mender Posted August 31, 2019 Report Share Posted August 31, 2019 14 hours ago, 67Mustang said: Not my car, was just looking at it and considering what it might need to bring up to date. It's a 74 914..... I've got a couple of spare flat sixes because I seem to collect junk.... Even with the current swap rules, a 1971 2.2 911E engine at 155 hp would swap in for 68 points and that engine has the same heads, valves and forged crank as the S. Also has the Bosch MFI so you could go a couple of ways, home port the heads and use bigger cams, or...... for another 100 points,,,,, turbo that sucker.... just exploring and thinking. For the same money though you could build a lot of other stuff that would be pretty fast as well.... The picture I included was one I found of a 914 cage to provide a comparison with what your picture shows. Like others, I'm concerned about the columnar strength being compromised by the hole. Best bet is to start over. Another concern is a front mounted cell, I had that option with my Fiero but I felt safer with the cell sitting beside me, inside the cage and NASCAR bars. Also, change in fuel load has minimal effect on handling when the cell is at or near the C of G of the car. Certainly some potential there though, light weight and big fuel tank plus Porsche parts could be fun! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Team Infiniti Posted August 31, 2019 Report Share Posted August 31, 2019 8 hours ago, mender said: So much for limiting costs and speed creep. This was discussed during the board meeting @ Charlotte, not only that, they clarified auto trans to have a torque convertor. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mender Posted September 1, 2019 Report Share Posted September 1, 2019 On 8/30/2019 at 7:42 AM, 67Mustang said: Not my car, was just looking at it and considering what it might need to bring up to date. It's a 74 914..... I've got a couple of spare flat sixes because I seem to collect junk.... Even with the current swap rules, a 1971 2.2 911E engine at 155 hp would swap in for 68 points and that engine has the same heads, valves and forged crank as the S. Also has the Bosch MFI so you could go a couple of ways, home port the heads and use bigger cams, or...... for another 100 points,,,,, turbo that sucker.... just exploring and thinking. For the same money though you could build a lot of other stuff that would be pretty fast as well.... Is one of those sixes a 2.0? If so, you can build yourself a 914/6 and not get any engine swap points. You would also get the 26.4 gallon fuel tank for the extra 50 points that the 914/6 is over the 914/4. That's only 5 points per gallon! But I guess one could argue that the 914/4 should also get the 26.4 gallon tank, just like the E30s and Miatas are allowed to use the biggest tank available for no points. Gotta be fair to everyone! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Black Magic Posted September 3, 2019 Report Share Posted September 3, 2019 On 8/30/2019 at 4:24 PM, wvumtnbkr said: Uh, a tenth of an inch could be the entire wall if it is .095" I butchered writing that... I meant within a tenth....like ten thousands, and instead wrote it as .100 vs .010. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
67Mustang Posted September 3, 2019 Author Report Share Posted September 3, 2019 (edited) Looking at the rest of the cage, it looks iffy, the joint at the top where the front halo bar comes in just looks off. Maybe its the picture angle not sure. Mender is right though, I like the HUGE tank for the 914-6. If I claim it as the 2.0 914-6, no need to worry about swap points, I take the 26.4 gal tank all for the 300 points. And, since it's a -6, I get the 911 brakes, front suspension, and 5 lug set up for free. Poly bushings all around, raise the spindles the std 18 mm on the strut, space for bump steer... still at 300 pts... lets see.... TURBO, +100, intercooler + 25, second oil cooler +20, throttle body, 25 pts. Port the heads stock cams.... I think is about 470 points. No rear sway bar , stock bar up front. Springs free, brakes, wheels free.. Wing/splitter/airdam + 30........ = 500 pts... With this the $2500 swap max goes out the window... I know I am missing something couldn't be that easy. Edited September 4, 2019 by 67Mustang Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
67Mustang Posted September 3, 2019 Author Report Share Posted September 3, 2019 I'm betting some here know of this particular turbo 914/6 from the late 70's out west. Wicked wing too 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
karman1970 Posted September 3, 2019 Report Share Posted September 3, 2019 I’m 99.9% positive 914/6s did not come with the big tank from the factory. They had the same tank as a 914/4. 914/6 GT could be had with the big tank. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
67Mustang Posted September 3, 2019 Author Report Share Posted September 3, 2019 Well, the 100 liter tank is straight up option 436 and the flares are M471. Both were Homologated by the SCCA... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ronh911 Posted September 3, 2019 Report Share Posted September 3, 2019 I would love for you to build it and hate to have to protest it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ablesnead Posted September 4, 2019 Report Share Posted September 4, 2019 you would actually raise the spindles.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
67Mustang Posted September 4, 2019 Author Report Share Posted September 4, 2019 44 minutes ago, ablesnead said: you would actually raise the spindles.. Yup you are correct! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
67Mustang Posted September 4, 2019 Author Report Share Posted September 4, 2019 5 hours ago, Ronh911 said: I would love for you to build it and hate to have to protest it. Ahhh... Don't be like that lol What's a little K36 among friends!! It would still be pretty entertaining even at 16.4 Plus 2... Nothing to protest there.... I guess if it were a Bimmer I could get away with running the big tank huh?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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