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37 minutes ago, LuckyKid said:

Just trying to find ways to keep up with those BMWs with cheaty swap weights. :)

No kidding, I'd love to have a more accurate swap weights so they can't get what should be close to a ~130pt swap hit for just 50pts....

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Miatas had their turn when they used the 1.6 VPI for their swaps ;)

Edited by ABR-Glen

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11 hours ago, ABR-Glen said:

Miatas had their turn when they used the 1.6 VPI for their swaps ;)

ish...still had to upgrade the dif for 25 pts and only had 11.9 gallons of fuel, oh and take a swap weight that was below what the actual as raced weight of the median as raced weights were found to be, so there is that......

Edited by hotchkis23

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1 minute ago, KoneKillah said:

IMO I think the Miata swap weight as it sits now is totally reasonable. I just think people keep too much crap on their car. 

I agree 100% with you, I have been a huge proponent  of using as raced weights from the get go.  Spent an entire day at Road America taking weights a couple years ago with approval from staff so they could collect data.  Personally, I want to see a median weight used.  Which, from the data set I collected would put an e30 around 2350-2400lbs(most were closer to 2200) and a Miata at 2100 fyi.

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8 hours ago, hotchkis23 said:

I agree 100% with you, I have been a huge proponent  of using as raced weights from the get go.  Spent an entire day at Road America taking weights a couple years ago with approval from staff so they could collect data.  Personally, I want to see a median weight used.  Which, from the data set I collected would put an e30 around 2350-2400lbs(most were closer to 2200) and a Miata at 2100 fyi.

 

Are those full fuel ready to go but no driver?

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10 minutes ago, turbogrill said:

Why is everyone so damn light! We are 2366 no driver in our NC Miata. Guess I need to go madmax

Because you are in an nc.....Things changed in the 15+ years between the NA and NC.  Sadly, with the Miata, there is not a lot you can really take out before you compromise the structure of the car.  Most of the cars that were brought across the scales were in former spec trim, so 2200+ weight, but the you have the Parts Badger ~75% car that still weighs in the 1950lbs range which is only 5% below the swap weight.   All the while other cars are able to be 20-25% less and get to a power to weight ratio that is outside the intended rule.  I also know that I took weights in the upper midwest and only the best builders are in the East, so then you could say that maybe the actual weights should be lower....

 

As much as I hate to even say it, with the swap rules not taking into account actual as raced MEDIAN weights, the fuel rule may need to be looked at....I have always thought that it was a great equalizer, but newer models coming into the series with 20+ gallon tanks and 250+ hp for under 500pts, there is only so much one can do to make 30 year old cars competitive because they are limited by fuel consumption.  Sorry for the soap box post.

Edited by hotchkis23
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9 hours ago, hotchkis23 said:

Because you are in an nc.....Things changed in the 15+ years between the NA and NC.  Sadly, with the Miata, there is not a lot you can really take out before you compromise the structure of the car.  Most of the cars that were brought across the scales were in former spec trim, so 2200+ weight, but the you have the Parts Badger ~75% car that still weighs in the 1950lbs range which is only 5% below the swap weight.   All the while other cars are able to be 20-25% less and get to a power to weight ratio that is outside the intended rule.  I also know that I took weights in the upper midwest and only the best builders are in the East, so then you could say that maybe the actual weights should be lower....

 

As much as I hate to even say it, with the swap rules not taking into account actual as raced MEDIAN weights, the fuel rule may need to be looked at....I have always thought that it was a great equalizer, but newer models coming into the series with 20+ gallon tanks and 250+ hp for under 500pts, there is only so much one can do to make 30 year old cars competitive because they are limited by fuel consumption.  Sorry for the soap box post.

 

>Because you are in an nc...

Yeah, it' seems to have about 10-15 more whp than an NB but heavier. But it looks cool, is fun to drive and is supposed to be reliable. It also works well with boost! (Not that it matters...) I can pass bad drivers in a NA/NB but get passed by good drivers in NA/NB. The dumbest thing is that it has the same ~13 gallon tank as the NB. So can go 1.5h at COTA....

 

> but newer models coming into the series with 20+ gallon tanks and 250+ hp for under 500pts,
What car is this?

 

 

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10 minutes ago, SonsOfIrony said:

 

How does that apply here?

 

reference to the above posts about special cars coming in with big HP and big tanks.

Edited by MoparBoyy

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1 hour ago, MoparBoyy said:

 

reference to the above posts about special cars coming in with big HP and big tanks.

 

The Altima was suspected to be an SE-R and therefore not legal.

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4 minutes ago, KoneKillah said:

 

The Altima was suspected to be an SE-R and therefore not legal.

I thought it WAS an SE-R.  I thought that was out in the open?  I don't know if there was discussion about it, but when I saw the car that's what I thought it was.

 

@Slugworks Paul

 

Can you correct me please?

Edited by wvumtnbkr

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13 minutes ago, KoneKillah said:

 

The Altima was suspected to be an SE-R and therefore not legal.

It is (openly?) claimed as an SE-R. SE-R was deemed to be a standard model Altima by tech. Paul has the paperwork, cleared it before he started the build. 

Edited by enginerd
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2 minutes ago, enginerd said:

It is (openly?) claimed as an SE-R. SE-R was deemed to be a standard model Altima by tech. Paul has the paperwork, cleared it before he started the build. 

 

I redact my statement then. Thank you.

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The SE-R package in those years was mostly just a trim package.  I'd bet all the parts that made it an SE-R either got pitched, turned to spares, or replaced under 2X.

 

It was pretty much the Eddie Bauer Edition of the Nissan world at that time.

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1 minute ago, SonsOfIrony said:

The SE-R package in those years was mostly just a trim package.  I'd bet all the parts that made it an SE-R either got pitched, turned to spares, or replaced under 2X.

 

It was pretty much the Eddie Bauer Edition of the Nissan world at that time.

You sure?

"The 2005 Nissan Altima received a facelift, including a new front grille, all-red taillights, redesigned interior, and an optional DVD-based navigation system. The V6 was now rated at 250 hp (186 kW) with torque rated at 249 lb⋅ft (338 N⋅m), and proven[citation needed] 0–60 mph (97 km/h) time of 6.2 seconds utilizing the 5-speed automatic transmission. Also new was the SE-R model with a 260 hp (194 kW) and 251 lb⋅ft (340 N⋅m) of torque version of the V6, a 6-speed manual transmission (automatic still optional), upgraded brakes, 18-inch wheels, a suspension even stiffer than that of the 3.5 SE's, and a high-flow exhaust.[11]Car and Driver tested the SE-R resulting in 0–60 mph (97 km/h) in 6.1 seconds.[12]MotorWeek episode #2432 tested an SE-R equipped with an automatic transmission that produced a 0–60 mph time of 5.8 seconds.[13]"

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19 minutes ago, hotchkis23 said:

You sure?

"The 2005 Nissan Altima received a facelift, including a new front grille, all-red taillights, redesigned interior, and an optional DVD-based navigation system. The V6 was now rated at 250 hp (186 kW) with torque rated at 249 lb⋅ft (338 N⋅m), and proven[citation needed] 0–60 mph (97 km/h) time of 6.2 seconds utilizing the 5-speed automatic transmission. Also new was the SE-R model with a 260 hp (194 kW) and 251 lb⋅ft (340 N⋅m) of torque version of the V6, a 6-speed manual transmission (automatic still optional), upgraded brakes, 18-inch wheels, a suspension even stiffer than that of the 3.5 SE's, and a high-flow exhaust.[11]Car and Driver tested the SE-R resulting in 0–60 mph (97 km/h) in 6.1 seconds.[12]MotorWeek episode #2432 tested an SE-R equipped with an automatic transmission that produced a 0–60 mph time of 5.8 seconds.[13]"

*not an expert, just spouting my thoughts on the above*
 

So, high flow exhaust probably accounts for the 10 hp, any ChampCar build would ditch the stock exhaust for something even better than the SER exhaust. 
Stiffer suspension (if it means springs) is also moot because any ChampCar builder would ditch or modify the springs to be far stiffer than that anyway.

Upgraded brakes could be further improved for 0 points to wilwoods or something of the sort regardless of the starting point.

and wheels are open. 

Edited by enginerd
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1 minute ago, enginerd said:

So, high flow exhaust probably accounts for the 10 hp, any ChampCar build would ditch the stock exhaust for something even better than the SER exhaust. 
Stiffer suspension (if it means springs) is also moot because any ChampCar builder would ditch or modify the springs to be far stiffer than that anyway.

You are aware that the springs are a big issue with this car, yes?

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