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To claim that the conditions at Road Atlanta were not the culprit for many of the issues is just ridiculous. It was not only raining, but there was slush off the racing line and the visibility sucked. I drove in the morning starting at ~9:30 to when the race went red and I finished the race, driving the last 32 laps of the race. The conditions created a huge speed differential and clusters of traffic that presented additional hazards. @Huggy and I racing each other the last 20+ minutes was pretty damn hair raising. It's unreasonable to expect everybody out there to be a good rain driver. The best you can do is protect your own car in those conditions. 

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Change the name back to Chumpcar.... in any event, whenever I start a race (unless we have a practice day) I take the first few laps at 70-75% until I get comfortable, and I never race like it is the last lap of the day and I'm in 2nd... but then again we don't really come out to try and win, just have fun.  

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3 hours ago, Bill Strong said:

Car upside down at Road Atlanta test day was an experienced racing team with experienced drivers but new to ChampCar.
The person that drove around the track during the red flag. I kinda remember something about that, but I won't comment as I don't really have that info. We go by what the corner workers tell race control.

 

So how come there was no mention of this sort of problem at Saturday morning's driver meeting?

 

According to the car that had skid marks on it's roof, the "other driver" was not so experienced.  Does not matter either way, there should have been a comment about it on Saturday morning.

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2 hours ago, Snorman said:

To claim that the conditions at Road Atlanta were not the culprit for many of the issues is just ridiculous. It was not only raining, but there was slush off the racing line and the visibility sucked. I drove in the morning starting at ~9:30 to when the race went red and I finished the race, driving the last 32 laps of the race. The conditions created a huge speed differential and clusters of traffic that presented additional hazards. @Huggy and I racing each other the last 20+ minutes was pretty damn hair raising. It's unreasonable to expect everybody out there to be a good rain driver. The best you can do is protect your own car in those conditions. 

 

Good or bad conditions, don't you think it's reasonable for drivers to keep it on the asphalt during a FCY.  Multiple pulls that got initiated while another was being performed.

 

Seat time is not all of the answer either.  My age brings the average of our drivers up a little bit, but my two codrivers had exactly 1 spin between them, never left the asphalt never touched another car.  Their average age at that event was 16.5 years.

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34 minutes ago, MMiskoe said:

 

Good or bad conditions, don't you think it's reasonable for drivers to keep it on the asphalt during a FCY.  

 

Things have to be kept in perspective here.  Remember it is very possible that some people might have been seeing their first snowfall, ever.

 

I drove in the dry and I dont know where the offs were and at what time but I can say that it's very realistic that a Florida driver could easily be coming down the hill into 10A and think they are good until they hit some slush and lock it up (if no abs).  Their experience in snow may be nil and they dont realize letting off the brakes is the right thing to do.

 

I'm sure many of us remember a professional that hit a jet dryer during a caution on a very banked track or the pace car Corvette driver who wrecked while leading the field...  sometimes things just happen mechanically or mentally... especially when putting in a very unexpected variable like we had at Road Atlanta.

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1 hour ago, MMiskoe said:

According to the car that had skid marks on it's roof, the "other driver" was not so experienced. 

Not defending, but might have some insight here, we were pitted next to the offending team involved in the rollover. They all had track days, solo events and some w2w circle track time but nothing road racy and definitely no experience like rd atl, it was quite a trial by fire for them. None were asshats, just green to this and ended their own day early, voluntarily, based on conditions vs experience.

They actually seem similar to our team 10 yrs ago.

56 minutes ago, MMiskoe said:

Seat time is not all of the answer either

In the above case, YES seat time is their only answer,  pit entry @ Rd Atl to a road racer newbie can cause hesitation/incidents just as it did, the resulting rollover was not good, thankfully it was in practice.

15 minutes ago, MPRLkld said:

Remember it is very possible that some people might have been seeing their first snowfall, ever.

First and last time this Fl guy personally drove in snow was a ill planned vacation to Colorado  30 yrs ago in a Caviler, then Snow Atl in a RWD D car, after a event-less 1.5 hrs I spun off track once in T1 after getting offline into what was assumed to be ice but later proved to be oil mixed with slush.

 

In the past there has been much worse at this race, targeting a couple of special teams for firm talks and reducing the # of entries has dramatically improved things.

 

Not really sure what more can be done, aside from whatever mentoring is realistic, i.e. pitting green next to seasoned (We have helped several teams like this)

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1 hour ago, MMiskoe said:

So how come there was no mention of this sort of problem at Saturday morning's driver meeting?

 

According to the car that had skid marks on it's roof, the "other driver" was not so experienced.  Does not matter either way, there should have been a comment about it on Saturday morning.

What would commenting about this incident in the driver's meeting accomplish?

 

1 hour ago, MMiskoe said:

 

Good or bad conditions, don't you think it's reasonable for drivers to keep it on the asphalt during a FCY.  Multiple pulls that got initiated while another was being performed.

 

Seat time is not all of the answer either.  My age brings the average of our drivers up a little bit, but my two codrivers had exactly 1 spin between them, never left the asphalt never touched another car.  Their average age at that event was 16.5 years.

Considering the conditions, it's not expected that some cars could leave the racing surface. Some drivers never even DROVE in the snow, much less race in it. 

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 Expanding on the mentoring, over the years, when someone has asked, we adopt a random person or three to join us to run a race as if they were regular teammates, it gives valuable insight on so many levels. 

 

 We have, With less success, had people come by to the shop and talk cars while we bang on the racecar 

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24 minutes ago, Team Infiniti said:

 

 We have, With less success, had people come by to the shop and talk cars while we bang on the racecar 

 

 

Too far away or I'd come over and talk E30s until you wanted to kick me back to Avon Park.🙂

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34 minutes ago, MPRLkld said:

 

 

Too far away or I'd come over and talk E30s until you wanted to kick me back to Avon Park.🙂

 Bring it! 

 

 Seriously, I’m 25 minutes from PBIR  we will need that e30 chat by then  😉

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20 hours ago, MMiskoe said:

Good or bad conditions, don't you think it's reasonable for drivers to keep it on the asphalt during a FCY.


You must have not driven right before or after the red flag period. 


Whist following the pace car going 20 mph, hearing the Miata behind just spinning its wheels and crab walking just trying to stay on the "cleared" line was telling of the conditions. 20mph in a straight line!
Some teams did not have appropriate tires for the conditions,  BFG Rivals are not ideal for Oilly slush mix. 
Also will confirm oil being down the whole way around the track at one point making the normal racing line super super slick, would get wheel spin in our 160whp Mid-Rear drive car in 4th gear.  
I was lucky most of  the time to get right behind the pace car which had a nice consistent speed.  The one time I did get stuck mid pack it was a huge stop and go fiasco. If you were grabbing for your inner windshield wiper and the cars in front decided to slow it could have been bad. 

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1 hour ago, dwendel said:


You must have not driven right before or after the red flag period. 


Whist following the pace car going 20 mph, hearing the Miata behind just spinning its wheels and crab walking just trying to stay on the "cleared" line was telling of the conditions. 20mph in a straight line!
Some teams did not have appropriate tires for the conditions,  BFG Rivals are not ideal for Oilly slush mix. 
Also will confirm oil being down the whole way around the track at one point making the normal racing line super super slick, would get wheel spin in our 160whp Mid-Rear drive car in 4th gear.  
I was lucky most of  the time to get right behind the pace car which had a nice consistent speed.  The one time I did get stuck mid pack it was a huge stop and go fiasco. If you were grabbing for your inner windshield wiper and the cars in front decided to slow it could have been bad. 

I went out as it started to snow at ~9:30 until the red flag. You're correct...the racing surface was cold and it started getting bad really quickly. At slow pace some cars were spinning up the hill out of T1 as well as coming up the hill to T11. 

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The hard part is staying calm.

 

Figure out how to balance the Sympathetic and Parasympathetic Nervous Systems. The sympathetic nervous system prepares the body for the “fight or flight” response during any potential danger. On the other hand, the parasympathetic nervous system inhibits the body from overworking and restores the body to a calm and composed state.

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1 hour ago, Chill said:

The hard part is staying calm.

 

Figure out how to balance the Sympathetic and Parasympathetic Nervous Systems. The sympathetic nervous system prepares the body for the “fight or flight” response during any potential danger. On the other hand, the parasympathetic nervous system inhibits the body from overworking and restores the body to a calm and composed state.

WTH? @Bill Strong

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My wife, a DNP, says everyone has a sympathetic nervous system and parasympathetic nervous system. So it could be real.

But then she yelled at me for interrupting her calls to patients. My office now supports two businesses, ChampCar, and Lung Cancer Screening.

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