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2020 Daytona race results, photos, and more


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  • Technical Advisory Committee
18 hours ago, Slugworks Paul said:

Meh. I'm with frank, I just play the hand i'm dealt, make myself a better racer or make my car better, and go try again.

I failed pretty miserably for about 6 years before I ever made a podium.


Technically you were winning races about 3 years in, just not in your own car :) 

Although it did have your engine in it, lol. 

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Had a buddy bring his nice camera out while he helped crew for us and he grabbed a bunch of shots of cars crossing the start/finish line.  I believe he's going to post up a link to the photos shortly.

#80 John Allen Special MIni Cooper S Daytona Race Recap AKA "The One That Got Away"   Post Road Atlanta we learned we had an engine problem. The car was a salvage title with no known histor

I followed the Crowd Control Mustang into the bus stop one time at the end and can honestly say my balls are not that big as deep as he drove in.  Congrats to that driver.  

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That definitely keeps the exh heat away from the driver. Funny seeing such a large single pipe on a car, I'm used to seeing something like that on a Ram with a CUmmins!  Anyone know what actually ended their day?  Just curious.

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On 7/7/2020 at 6:28 PM, frankrehnelt said:

Still have to finish. The Mitu and Vette were also fast but.....boom. KSR was off their game. I love seeing the fast Riley cars. Might be a little unfair but hey.......we get to race those guys and if we have our crap sorted we can beat them. Good stuff. 

You give Bill Riley points to play with he is going to do his best to hurt you...

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On 7/8/2020 at 1:13 PM, Slugworks Paul said:

Meh. I'm with frank, I just play the hand i'm dealt, make myself a better racer or make my car better, and go try again.
 

 

We do that too...and I don't have an issue with you personally or anyone really. Come say hi some time. I'm about as easy going as anyone. My problem is with the way Champcar keeps allowing cost and speed creep. We all have to play with the hand "you" are dealt too, which in this case, you also thought was unfair as you gave yourself extra points. 

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31 minutes ago, XelderX said:

 

We do that too...and I don't have an issue with you personally or anyone really. Come say hi some time. I'm about as easy going as anyone. My problem is with the way Champcar keeps allowing cost and speed creep. We all have to play with the hand "you" are dealt too, which in this case, you also thought was unfair as you gave yourself extra points. 


Where did I say it was unfair? I was given 3 options and felt pretty backed into a corner:
1. Do nothing, get protested and champcar will approve the protest.
2. Take a transmission swap value - and still be protestable due to the various other differences between SE and SE-R (chisek agreed this would technically be correct)
3. Take a VPI increase. 
 

4 days before the race. Even though I had my original VPI approved by chisek.

Doesn't seem like I 'gave myself extra points'. 

You can try to mole whack my car all you want but I assure you, you won't get easy victory against me in another car and you will continue to play the hand "I" am dealt, along with every well sorted team (crowd control, cone crushers, RBank, etc.). Thus my point about improving your game - you will not find the easy path to success you are hoping for by complaining about others. I also think trying to quash speed creep entirely is a fruitless pursuit, speeds will always increase even if you freeze every rule in the book, and every value.

 

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21 minutes ago, Slugworks Paul said:


You can try to mole whack my car all you want but I assure you, you won't get easy victory against me in another car and you will continue to play the hand "I" am dealt, along with every well sorted team (crowd control, cone crushers, RBank, etc.).
 

 

His team has been racing a car that didn't even have a properly running engine while also complaining that other teams are too fast.  Some people need to up there own game first.

 

Our rental car 626 brings home trophies, it was like 2 years ago it was the 'gold standard' per someone who plotted top finishes vs number of starts.  clearly its not always the car but the team that wins races.  The next closest mustang to finish to us was 46th, out of 6 or 7 that started.

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20 minutes ago, Slugworks Paul said:


Where did I say it was unfair? I was given 3 options and felt pretty backed into a corner:
1. Do nothing, get protested and champcar will approve the protest.
2. Take a transmission swap value - and still be protestable due to the various other differences between SE and SE-R (chisek agreed this would technically be correct)
3. Take a VPI increase. 
 

4 days before the race. Even though I had my original VPI approved by chisek.

Doesn't seem like I 'gave myself extra points'. 

You can try to mole whack my car all you want but I assure you, you won't get easy victory against me in another car and you will continue to play the hand "I" am dealt, along with every well sorted team (crowd control, cone crushers, RBank, etc.). Thus my point about improving your game - you will not find the easy path to success you are hoping for by complaining about others. I also think trying to quash speed creep entirely is a fruitless pursuit, speeds will always increase even if you freeze every rule in the book, and every value.

 

I agree with 99 percent of this....  the only point I would like to make is that there are sooo many free things or lower point value items that in the last 3 years, I went from a basically stock rx7 at 500 pts to an engine and trans swapped rx7 with almost 50 hp more and front and rear aero plus a bunch of other stuff.

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2 minutes ago, wvumtnbkr said:

I agree with 99 percent of this....  the only point I would like to make is that there are sooo many free things or lower point value items that in the last 3 years, I went from a basically stock rx7 at 500 pts to an engine and trans swapped rx7 with almost 50 hp more and front and rear aero plus a bunch of other stuff.


I'm sure that is causing some speed creep. I'm on the fence about 'free' items - I think some were good and some were bad. I think some other things should be made free to decrease the 'real' cost of racing but are perceived as an increase in the cost of racing (and yes, I'm talking about oil coolers, among other things)

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4 minutes ago, MoparBoyy said:

 

His team has been racing a car that didn't even have a properly running engine while also complaining that other teams are too fast.  Some people need to up there own game first.

 

Our rental car 626 brings home trophies, it was like 2 years ago it was the 'gold standard' per someone who plotted top finishes vs number of starts.  clearly its not always the car but the team that wins races.  The next closest mustang to finish to us was 46th, out of 6 or 7 that started.

 

We didn't know we had a problem. The fault was programmed to only throw a CEL after it occurred twice. Since the ECU gets cycled with the kill switch we never had any reason to believe we had an issue as our CEL has been off. We were chasing what we thought was a crap exhaust design hurting us. We finally found a good tuner we can trust and $1000 later it looks like we are actually making what we should. Charlotte should be interesting. 

 

We haven't complained that other teams are too fast. We contend that there is way too much free stuff and tech is too worried about the value of materials holding our passenger door on and not worried about stuff that actually matters. I chatted with another car owner over the weekend that ran at Daytona. I'm not alone in my thinking...others just aren't being vocal about it. 

 

 

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36 minutes ago, MoparBoyy said:

Our rental car 626 brings home trophies, it was like 2 years ago it was the 'gold standard' per someone who plotted top finishes vs number of starts.  clearly its not always the car but the team that wins races.

Has the 626 won anything that wasn’t specific to B-class?

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1 minute ago, enginerd said:

Has the 626 won anything that wasn’t specific to B-class? You finish 17th place and then act like it’s some great accomplishment because you managed to beat the rest of the cars that happen to be in the poorly represented B class...

Some of us are happy with small victories.

We're not all as successful as your team. 

 

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51 minutes ago, XelderX said:

 

We didn't know we had a problem. The fault was programmed to only throw a CEL after it occurred twice. Since the ECU gets cycled with the kill switch we never had any reason to believe we had an issue as our CEL has been off. We were chasing what we thought was a crap exhaust design hurting us. We finally found a good tuner we can trust and $1000 later it looks like we are actually making what we should. Charlotte should be interesting. 

 

We haven't complained that other teams are too fast. We contend that there is way too much free stuff and tech is too worried about the value of materials holding our passenger door on and not worried about stuff that actually matters. I chatted with another car owner over the weekend that ran at Daytona. I'm not alone in my thinking...others just aren't being vocal about it. 


So to summarize, you made a mistake and it hurt your car's performance? No offense as that happens to everyone, but teams who have a lot of expertise and thoroughly test their car might have caught that before the car made it to a race. 

You ultimately *are* complaining that other teams are too fast. You and many others like to frame it/focus primarily on the car while neglecting the other factors that makes teams good. That would be my primary issue. There is a data point  (the other SE-R that races in the series) that says my car isn't a magic bullet but that doesn't support your narrative.

If you want to make a change or petition the membership and the BoD, there is a mechanism for that and it isn't griping on the forums (because that makes you look like a complainer IMO). I fully support your ability to exercise it. Unfortunately my personal faith in the system is very shaken right now as it was bypassed to give me penalty laps at daytona. I think we need to put faith in our people (BoD, TAC) and processes and many issues will get worked out.

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@Snorman We had the Mini as many as 10 laps ahead of the 626, which included running out of fuel on the 1st stint and essentially running 1h 20min stints after that. I never really saw, did you guys have issues at all? It didnt look like average lap times were too terribly different.

 

 

Also, B Class is becoming very competitive. If the Rotary Rocketeers can keep their car together they would be untouchable. The Ecotec swapped Miatas are also rocketships.

 

Regarding the rotary, depending on who you ask its either a 1.3 or a 2.6, A and C class. How did they end up in B? Sure has the speed to keep up with most C class cars.

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  • Technical Advisory Committee
24 minutes ago, mindspin311 said:

Regarding the rotary, depending on who you ask its either a 1.3 or a 2.6, A and C class. How did they end up in B? Sure has the speed to keep up with most C class cars.

 

 

1.3 plus one class

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31 minutes ago, mindspin311 said:

@Snorman We had the Mini as many as 10 laps ahead of the 626, which included running out of fuel on the 1st stint and essentially running 1h 20min stints after that. I never really saw, did you guys have issues at all? It didnt look like average lap times were too terribly different.

 

 

Also, B Class is becoming very competitive. If the Rotary Rocketeers can keep their car together they would be untouchable. The Ecotec swapped Miatas are also rocketships.

 

Regarding the rotary, depending on who you ask its either a 1.3 or a 2.6, A and C class. How did they end up in B? Sure has the speed to keep up with most C class cars.

The 626 was in the pit with a fuel pump issue early in the race. I was in our other car, but believe we were in the box for at least 20 minutes. 

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56 minutes ago, Slugworks Paul said:


So to summarize, you made a mistake and it hurt your car's performance? No offense as that happens to everyone, but teams who have a lot of expertise and thoroughly test their car might have caught that before the car made it to a race. 

You ultimately *are* complaining that other teams are too fast. You and many others like to frame it/focus primarily on the car while neglecting the other factors that makes teams good. That would be my primary issue. There is a data point  (the other SE-R that races in the series) that says my car isn't a magic bullet but that doesn't support your narrative.

If you want to make a change or petition the membership and the BoD, there is a mechanism for that and it isn't griping on the forums (because that makes you look like a complainer IMO). I fully support your ability to exercise it. Unfortunately my personal faith in the system is very shaken right now as it was bypassed to give me penalty laps at daytona. I think we need to put faith in our people (BoD, TAC) and processes and many issues will get worked out.

 

I'm perfectly content with how being a dissenting voice. It doesn't bother me and I think it's important. I've been around long enough to see other race series die and the reasons why. Champcar is headed in the same direction. 

 

I am on your side with the issues you personally had with your points. That's part of my gripe with the series as a whole. Being told one thing and ending up with something else is a problem we should all be fearful of and it seems to happen a lot around here. 

 

Please don't think we aren't an experienced team. This is just our first season back with a completely new drivetrain/aero and to be fair....we are playing catch-up while doing it with the bare minimums. We didn't even know the tech-desk existed until a few weeks ago. That's been an eye-opener. More things changed over those years away from the series than we thought. 

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A stock rotary should dominate b class at every race it shows up....

 

They are like b+....

 

Rotary engines are crazy reliable in this type of racing.  The trans and dif are crazy reliable if you feed them idemitsu oil and treat them carefully.

 

The only downside is the wiring.  Redo that and collect b class trophies...

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16 minutes ago, Jab31169 said:

 

And the sound... That terrible ear piercing sound

Naw.  I don't understand why people do that.  We won limerock....  twice....  under the noise limit with the rotary.  Those people just didn't do their homework.

 

Any loud rotary better be lapping the field.   Otherwise, put a muffler or 2 on that poop.

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1 minute ago, wvumtnbkr said:

Naw.  I don't understand why people do that.  We won limerock....  twice....  under the noise limit with the rotary.  Those people just didn't do their homework.

 

Any loud rotary better be lapping the field.   Otherwise, put a muffler or 2 on that poop.

Or swap it!

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