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2020 Lifeline VIR 24-Hour Classic results


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2 hours ago, XelderX said:

 

It was listed as 2003, so AP1. With wing and I believe 4 vents on the front....520 points. No biggie. We were pretty certain their transmission wouldn't last....any idea what took them out?

When their troubles began, I saw on the in-car camera they had a lot fluid on their windshield.  First I thought it was rain but it wasn't raining.  They pitted and added a lot of oil or water to it, cleaned the windscreen and sent him back out but they kept slowing and coming into the pits, so not sure if they were over heating but possibly.

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We had the stars align in a unique and awesome way.    Rounded up a solid group of drivers and crew despite the COVID issue. 3 RV's and 2 Trailers made it to the track with no issues.

Won't have an oil temp issue if you don't run an oil temp gauge     AND just to keep this thread on track congrats to @Huggy and the rest of the team.  Absolute masterpiece of a ra

I have been out of the seat for awhile. 2016 was my last full year of racing as I took on this job at ChampCar. Since then I did two races in the hyper slow Opel GT, one race in a Celica, and 1/2 a

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We had the stars align in a unique and awesome way. 

 

Rounded up a solid group of drivers and crew despite the COVID issue.

3 RV's and 2 Trailers made it to the track with no issues.

 

Gathered and Froze 80 gallon antifreeze jugs for cool suits

Managed to get 2 working freezers to the track even with the national freezer shortage

Found both of my fuel drums damaged on Wednesday evening, but sourced 3 replacement plastic ones this go around to avoid the rust issue. 

Filled both cars plus 180 gallons in drums and cans on the way to the track.

 

Both cars fully prepped, 146 solidly tested on 3 weekends.  8 new RS-4's.

 

Had some solid fun Friday drinking beers with everyone.  HJ came by with some prize-winning beer for Dangers Out's winning the iRacing Covid-Cup. 

Pretty laid back and enjoyable day, plus the good luck mexican fiesta dinner before a good nights sleep.

 

Took both cars out to bed in the brakes and as a final check first thing Saturday.  No issues, just some small adjustments to the aero and tire pressures.

 

 

 

Race started with us pretty far back, but its a long race and you certainly don't win it in the first stint (but lots of people lost it).

 

A couple of incidents, but thankfully nothing major.

 

Stint 1 246:

Contact with RSX.  Quick Pit to check it over.  Knocked the front pretty good, crooked wheel and doesn't turn left well anymore.  Our fault, driver discussed with other team.  Sorry.

Stint 5 246:

Contact with S14.  No damage to car, no stop needed.    I was driving.  No discussion with other team, sorry about that. 

Stint 11 246:  

Camera brakes off the go pro mount.  Quick drive through pit to save my YI from knocking around on the lanyard for 2 hours.

 

Stint 2 146:

Throttle cable lock nut comes off.  Throttle stops responding, car down on power per driver.  Drive through to check, nothing observed.  Engine sounds good on blipping throttle body.  Send him back out under FCY and he can't even keep up.  Make it back to the paddock and figure it out.  Total time delay 10 minutes (4 laps).  Some Locktite cost 146 the "W" against her sister.

Impound:

Both front brake rotors cracked completely through the outside disk...  Time to take this back to the drawing board and make an upgrade.

 

 

The cherry on top was being able to cross the checkers 1-2 with my dad.  I feel pretty special being able to check that one off the list!

 

 

Laps of Honor mustang and Danger Racing Team e36,  I'm pretty annoyed you decided to go three wide on us at the checkers.  The e36 got pointed by the ENTIRE back straight and denied the pass.  Why change your mind at the SF?  The mustang came up at a massive closing speed to the checkers.  Did you not know it was the LAST lap?  WTF.  No need for such a risky move with the race basically over.

 

Sorry to see Damson, Castrol, and the S2K out early.  We had a good race going, with the Lexus, Honda, and 246 passing the lead around for a few hours there. 

 

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2 hours ago, Huggy said:

Laps of Honor mustang and Danger Racing Team e36,  I'm pretty annoyed you decided to go three wide on us at the checkers.  

 

I just want to clarify this was not the same group that races the SC300 under the "Danger Racing Group" banner...

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21 minutes ago, Hurljohn said:

I just want to clarify this was not the same group that races the SC300 under the "Danger Racing Group" banner...

But they stole your name...

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901 Motorsport brought 2 e30s to VIR to play for 24 hrs (we hoped).  #901 (red) and #903 (assorted shades of ugly). 

Started right near the back but as others have said, is a long race.  The two cars were very even on speed, a little light on pure pace vs the Pinkies Out e30s, but able to run consistently hard so we settled in to try to run a mistake-free race. 

After the first stint we were running with 903 in 4th and 901 in 6th and would stay roughly in those positions +/- fuel stops for a long time.  

As darkness came we had our first hiccup. 903 suffered a fluky internal short in a driving light that kept blowing fuses. Lost 20 min figuring it out and had to run without one light.  Then 903 had some minor wheel to wheel contact that toed out the nose a little (and made it handle different but not worse).  She went back out in 15th and started the work to gain back the positions. 

At 
1 am things got ugly for the 901.  Pitting out of 5th place, she broke a belt, took out lots of the sensors in the process, and overheated.  Done.   

We shifted all focus to the 903, with all team drivers now taking stints as we pushed to bring her home.  Finished 5th, uglier than ever but rolling strong. 

Props to all drivers and crew for a super fun weekend.  The cars were really well prepped.  And congrats to the young guns Craig and Aaron for setting fast lap in each car, all the while being super clean.  The torch has been passed.

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1 hour ago, eyeballs19 said:

At 1 am things got ugly for the 901.  Pitting out of 5th place, she broke a belt, took out lots of the sensors in the process, and overheated.


When the belt running the alternator and water pump broke it unplugged the AIM oil pressure sensor. This lit the whole dash up in red. A smaller pretty non threatening light blue light right below would tell us the alternator is not working. Well, I didn’t notice that small not very angry light. We started getting hot alarms but the low oil pressure alarms are priority on the dash so the temp alarm will flash once then moved to a small line at the bottom. We plugged the oil pressure sensor back in then the temperature alarm took precedence. We thought we were getting a hot alarm because the car had been sitting too long with the fan off. So, “send it”. I didn’t realize what was really going on until it was too late. Half a lap without the water pump running cooked her. Done. 

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3 hours ago, eyeballs19 said:

.   
We shifted all focus to the 903, with all team drivers now taking stints as we pushed to bring her home.  Finished 5th, uglier than ever but rolling strong. 
.

Great race. You guys were strong, consistent and fun to run against...

Good job focusing on the important things and getting top 5

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16 hours ago, XelderX said:

Just out of curiosity...

 

Did the BBY Honda S2000 start with penalty laps? I just realized it's a 500pt car, but it had a wing and hood vents. Not trying to call someone out....just wondering if I missed another tech desk ruling or something. 

 

15 hours ago, chip said:

that's a good question- I think we asked but never got an answer-  @Huggy did you ever hear anything?

 

14 hours ago, XelderX said:

 

It was listed as 2003, so AP1. With wing and I believe 4 vents on the front....520 points. No biggie. We were pretty certain their transmission wouldn't last....any idea what took them out?

 

12 hours ago, Paulie said:

When their troubles began, I saw on the in-car camera they had a lot fluid on their windshield.  First I thought it was rain but it wasn't raining.  They pitted and added a lot of oil or water to it, cleaned the windscreen and sent him back out but they kept slowing and coming into the pits, so not sure if they were over heating but possibly.

 

10 hours ago, jakks said:

Pretty certain they were cutouts in the OEM hood. At least that's what I remember seeing when I had to check for oil residue on the hood at pit out. They puked a ton of oil out during the night, so failure/DNF may be related to that.

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=10164040419125113&set=pcb.3255920991169770&type=3&theater&ifg=1

 

1. Car is a 2003 S2000 Ap1 500 Points 

2. Wing is 10 Points and was added to LogBook/ Tech Sheet 

3. Car started 2 laps down because of wing (510 Points) 

4. Vents are all Cut by hand with a Dremel and Bent  (yes it took forever but result came of very Nice)

5. Oil started to puke from Catch can, not sure why Quite yet. Car was running hot all race. Will post a full race report soon. 

 

 

IMG_1893.jpg

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5 hours ago, the5 said:

5. Oil started to puke from Catch can, not sure why Quite yet. Car was running hot all race.

Might want to think about adding an real oil cooler. The car can easily make up the additional laps in a 24 and probably even shorter races. 

 

I am amazed on how many cars don't have oil coolers. We have a 8x12inch single core, the highest oil temps we saw were 117°C. I don't know of any factory equiped car that has enough oil cooler for Enduro racing.

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20 minutes ago, dwendel said:

Might want to think about adding an real oil cooler. The car can easily make up the additional laps in a 24 and probably even shorter races. 

 

I am amazed on how many cars don't have oil coolers. We have a 8x12inch single core, the highest oil temps we saw were 117°C. I don't know of any factory equiped car that has enough oil cooler for Enduro racing.

 

I am running the car without the oil cooler as 4 laps down is very hard to over come over the 24 hour. 

The cars oil temps were about 280 at the highest. 

 

Hopefully ChampCar Recognizes soon that oil coolers should be free or way less points to save us all money....

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28 minutes ago, dwendel said:

 

I am amazed on how many cars don't have oil coolers. We have a 8x12inch single core, the highest oil temps we saw were 117°C. I don't know of any factory equiped car that has enough oil cooler for Enduro racing.


Because some don’t need it. 

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7 minutes ago, Huggy said:

@the5 those vents look awesome.  Did they make an affect on under hood temps?

Not sure as we had them since we built the car 2 years ago, they just didnt stand out as they were the same color as the hood. 

 

The Fender Vents are new to hopefully balance out the wing a bit 

IMG_5110.jpg

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18 minutes ago, the5 said:

 

I am running the car without the oil cooler as 4 laps down is very hard to over come over the 24 hour. 

The cars oil temps were about 280 at the highest. 

 

Hopefully ChampCar Recognizes soon that oil coolers should be free or way less points to save us all money....

 
280F is on the high side of what I would like to see, Remember the water jackets in the engine not only have to absorb and heat transfer the combustion heat but also the oil heat. The factory sandwich plate oil cooler is adding 280+F temps right into the coolant system. Adding a separate O2A cooler would not only cool your oil temps but also you water temps. If you say you are running too hot, an real oil cooler is where I would start, as going to a 300$+ rad is 30 points. You could also try radiator exit ducting but then you will take material points I guesstimate about 4sqft of Al or 8 points. But that may not solve you issue.
It seems that your options are to drive at lower RPMs to reduce heat load, take 4 laps for oil cooler or keep DNFing due to overheating issues. 

As far as points, oil cooler is the correct amount at 20 points (still less then a good radiator). If we start giving away everything then there is no way to keep cars balanced. You started with a 500 point car, you have to deal with that. Just like I started with a 150 point car, we have our own challenges on how to balance points and speed to make the car competitive against a basically stock S2000. 
Did you not take material points for the catch can? Even a plastic soda bottle is about 1 square foot of plastic at 3 points a sqft. 

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15 minutes ago, dwendel said:

 
280F is on the high side of what I would like to see, Remember the water jackets in the engine not only have to absorb and heat transfer the combustion heat but also the oil heat. The factory sandwich plate oil cooler is adding 280+F temps right into the coolant system. Adding a separate O2A cooler would not only cool your oil temps but also you water temps. If you say you are running too hot, an real oil cooler is where I would start, as going to a 300$+ rad is 30 points. You could also try radiator exit ducting but then you will take material points I guesstimate about 4sqft of Al or 8 points. But that may not solve you issue.
It seems that your options are to drive at lower RPMs to reduce heat load, take 4 laps for oil cooler or keep DNFing due to overheating issues. 

As far as points, oil cooler is the correct amount at 20 points (still less then a good radiator). If we start giving away everything then there is no way to keep cars balanced. You started with a 500 point car, you have to deal with that. Just like I started with a 150 point car, we have our own challenges on how to balance points and speed to make the car competitive against a basically stock S2000. 
Did you not take material points for the catch can? Even a plastic soda bottle is about 1 square foot of plastic at 3 points a sqft. 

 

280 Was the highest we have seen and for some reason water temps this race were 220-24 where typically they are 200 and that was for the entire race so I think there might have been an underlying issue. 

 

I know there are always people anti-Coolers, but every other series in existence allows coolers for no point hit. I will keep advocating for free (Or at least reduced) coolers to save everyone money and I will keep racing my car without it to prove the point. 

 

As far as I know and was told Catch Cans are non- Points as they are saftey vs Dumping oil on the track. Dont kill the messenger.

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3 minutes ago, the5 said:

 

280 Was the highest we have seen and for some reason water temps this race were 220-24 where typically they are 200 and that was for the entire race so I think there might have been an underlying issue. 

 

I know there are always people anti-Coolers...

 

As far as I know and was told Catch Cans are non- Points as they are saftey vs Dumping oil on the track. Dont kill the messenger.

 

Hmm, that does sound underlineing then, hope it's a easy fix.

People will be always for or anti something as we are all racers and want to make advantage of everything we can. 

Ahh another one of the hidden rules. I always listed stuff like that on our sheet at materials cause we have room in our vpi to claim dumb things. But I would agree on it being a saftey if tech calls it that. 

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1 minute ago, tommytipover said:

Catch tanks are required, no points.

 

9.11.1. Non-stock engine, transmission/transaxle, and differential
breathers shall be equipped with catch tanks.
9.11.1.1. Minimum catch tank capacity shall be one U.S. quart

Ahh I was looking for it in the section 4. 

 

Thanks!

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3 hours ago, the5 said:

Hopefully ChampCar Recognizes soon that oil coolers should be free or way less points to save us all money....

 

 

It's not "ChampCar", it's the members that keep saying no to oil oil coolers.  The peeps for the most part on the BOD would most likely vote yes if not for the overwhelming NO from the membership.
So I guess it is "ChampCar" as the members are what make the club.

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If your radiator has a auto trans cooler in the bottom or sides of it, that can be used as a legal free oil cooler. Lots of OEM replacement radiators come with that built in, and they wont cost you a single point to use as a trans oil, power steering oil, engine oil, rear differential cooler.

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4 minutes ago, Bill Strong said:

 

 

It's not "ChampCar", it's the members that keep saying no to oil oil coolers.  The peeps for the most part on the BOD would most likely vote yes if not for the overwhelming NO from the membership.
So I guess it is "ChampCar" as the members are what make the club.


I think I submitted a cooler petition as I do every year. Did the vote happen yet? I didn’t see the membership results.

 

Maybe the No’s can meet In the middle and bring the value of a cooler down from 20 points. When a Wing is 10, and hell coilovers are 10 points a corner. 
 

Tons of my AER friends won’t race champ because they all have coolers on their cars to save money by not blowing their stuff up.

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8 minutes ago, Bill Strong said:

If your radiator has a auto trans cooler in the bottom or sides of it, that can be used as a legal free oil cooler. Lots of OEM replacement radiators come with that built in, and they wont cost you a single point to use as a trans oil, power steering oil, engine oil, rear differential cooler.


non oe Radiator is 5 points but that’s not a bad Idea, I may run with it...

 

Does anyone know what cars come stock with this setup? 

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Just now, the5 said:


I think I submitted a cooler petition as I do every year. Did the vote happen yet? I didn’t see the membership results.

 

Maybe the No’s can meet In the middle and bring the value of a cooler down from 20 points. When a Wing is 10, and hell coilovers are 10 points a corner. 

 

 

Yes. I have been working on the petition presentation to the membership for about 3 days now. 

Myself and others have requested oil coolers to be free since the beginning of points. But, it is always voted down. I think that the people that don't want to spend the money, or the people that only do a couple or less races a year see this as a competitive advantage. Allowing free coolers allows those guys with the skill, know-how, and money to take their open ECU engines to the limit with tuning, allowing them to control temps with coolers.
 

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