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How much for home made rear toe adjsutments?


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Just now, enginerd said:

Whether it has been done or not, it is absolutely allowed. Remember when that rule came out of nowhere when the new rules were released one year and then got retracted a week later? That rule said “even if you are using repurposed parts, fixed points list items are fixed points”.

I remember it. But I don't believe it's "absolutely allowed". It completely opens the door and even though some poor decisions have been made lately, I don't think this would fly. 

The biggest discussion about this I recall was the Danger Racing car, which "repurposed" the rear deck lid to make a spoiler. That was, IMO, simply reshaping a body panel as one would do with a fender behind the front wheel or a hood heat extractor, etc.. 

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Late to the party here but let me just say:   On the original topic of adjustable toe links, before the tech desk was a thing I specifically emailed to see if I could take an OEM BMW sway ba

Whether it has been done or not, it is absolutely allowed. Remember when that rule came out of nowhere when the new rules were released one year and then got retracted a week later? That rule said “ev

honestly if they are still using OEM end links, i'd call em free.  Hardware is free, all you are doing is adding hardware to the stock link.  I think this is EXACTLY what the series should be striving

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5 minutes ago, MoparBoyy said:

the issue became when someone said "fasteners are free, so what if i build a wing out of fasteners and spare parts?"

In my backyard foundry...

Again, unless somebody can prove that a precedent has been set and a free wing, intake, suspension part, etc. has been made out of repurposed material, I'll doubt it's possible for zero points. 

EDIT: to be clear, I completely agree that material or repurposed material can be made to modify, strengthen, etc. a part. But to completely fabricate something like a wing or intake for free? Uhhh...

Edited by Snorman
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39 minutes ago, Snorman said:

I'm pretty certain you can NOT build parts on the fixed value list from repurposed material. I know people have gotten flairs and some other things, but I'm not aware of anybody building a wing, splitter, header or intake from repurposed material and getting it for zero points. 

For sure has happened.  Airdam and spoilers I know of for fact.

 

The sc300 that used the back edge of its decklid as a spoiler comes to mind. Edit...  danger ranger car.

 

How is that different?  It's a spoiler from a part of the car that wasn't charged fpv?

 

I know of a few airdam that were made from repurposed parts.

 

Ask tech.  I'm a little afraid to call those people out and have them explain what they did.

Edited by wvumtnbkr
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3 minutes ago, wvumtnbkr said:

For sure has happened.  Airdam and spoilers I know of for fact.

 

The sc300 that used the back edge of its decklid as a spoiler comes to mind.

 

that is not a wing, they reshaped the panel.  left a huge hole in the trunk.

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Just now, MoparBoyy said:

 

that is not a wing, they reshaped the panel.  left a huge hole in the trunk.

I wasn't talking about a wing.

 

I was talking about items on the fpv list that were made out of repurposed parts.

 

A spoiler was clarified as being 10 pts and falls under the aero part of the fpv  table.

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Just now, wvumtnbkr said:

For sure has happened.  Airdam and spoilers I know of for fact.

 

The sc300 that used the back edge of its decklid as a spoiler comes to mind.

That's Danger. They simply flipped up the rear skin on the decklid. It wasn't even removed from the panel. What's the difference between doing that and cutting the hood to create an air extractor behind the radiator, or modifying the fender behind the front wheel well as so many cars do? I personally thought it was a great idea. 

But you know, we removed parts such as the vibration damper from the rear axle assembly of our car as well as some other metal parts. Can we throw those in a foundry, melt them down and fashion them into stuff like swaybars for free? 

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1 minute ago, Snorman said:

That's Danger. They simply flipped up the rear skin on the decklid. It wasn't even removed from the panel. What's the difference between doing that and cutting the hood to create an air extractor behind the radiator, or modifying the fender behind the front wheel well as so many cars do? I personally thought it was a great idea. 

But you know, we removed parts such as the vibration damper from the rear axle assembly of our car as well as some other metal parts. Can we throw those in a foundry, melt them down and fashion them into stuff like swaybars for free? 

That exact question was asked on this very forum and the powers that be said something to the effect of:  you better document the crap out of it, but sure!

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17 minutes ago, MoparBoyy said:

the issue became when someone said "fasteners are free, so what if i build a wing out of fasteners and spare parts?"

The fastener rule says that they are free ‘when used to fasten things to other things’ or something like that. Doesn’t say that they can be used as a building material. 

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5 minutes ago, enginerd said:

The fastener rule says that they are free ‘when used to fasten things to other things’ or something like that. Doesn’t say that they can be used as a building material. 

 

and people said "but it fastens the wing!"  people want to stretch things just to be a-holes.

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Maybe I am extremely stupid, but the rules doesn't say anything that you can repurpose material? So how can it even be a discussion about it?

 

I don't think you can just assume it.

 

Same with the other 10000 lovely topics we have had today.

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21 minutes ago, turbogrill said:

Maybe I am extremely stupid, but the rules doesn't say anything that you can repurpose material? So how can it even be a discussion about it?

 

I don't think you can just assume it.

 

Same with the other 10000 lovely topics we have had today.

Rules don't say you can't.  Check the linked topic above....

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10 minutes ago, wvumtnbkr said:

Rules don't say you can't.  Check the linked topic above....

 

True, but if you are new to champcar I don't think you would assume that you can build a wing out of your doorbar and gurney flaps out of a license plate.

 

A clarification on something that could save you ~40pts by just being stubborn in the garage would be nice :) Will ask for that.

 

anyhow, thank you for linking that thread.

 

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8 hours ago, turbogrill said:

 

I struggle little to understand this.

 

Option A : You spend 5 hours modify your OEM suspension, no points

Option B : You pay someone $600 to modify your OEM suspensio, no points

Option C : You buy the component for $150, 10 pts (or whatever)
 

If you do Option A you saved $150, great!

If you do Option B you saved 5hours.

If you are a poor sucker without any tools or skills you do Option C.

 

End result is the same. 

Dont bring logic into this! There's no place for that in champcar.

Edited by Slugworks Paul
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14 hours ago, Snorman said:

People will never understand that it doesn't matter what you buy or build. If you can't drive it, strategize and build the right team you're not going to win any races anyway. 

 

Great, just great. Give away the secret sauce for free. What the heck.

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Late to the party here but let me just say:

 

On the original topic of adjustable toe links, before the tech desk was a thing I specifically emailed to see if I could take an OEM BMW sway bar link, which is a solid, round metal rod with two ball joints at the end, cut it in half, thread the ends, and run them into a coupling nut secured with lock nuts to make an ajustable sway bar link and was told in no uncertain terms - zero points, fabrication and fasteners are free. 

 

On the topic of repurposing material to make items on the fixed point value list, this is 100% allowed as long as everything is documented. Our ~3 inch air damn, normally a 10 point item, is repurposed rear bumper material. When you look at everything this is totally obvious - you can see exactly what we cut away from our rear bumper. I have pointed it out to tech 3 different times, and all 3 times it was deemed zero points. I've seen other teams running the same platform using bumper trim and panel moldings in the same way.

 

There was a lot of controversy over that SC300, and they ALMOST changed the rules to say you could not use repurposed material to create something on the fixed point value list - members of the tech group were specifically advocating for that rule change, but Mike C. came over the top and said, basically, "Nope - this is a builders' series and repurposing material in creative ways is exactly what we want to encourage."

 

Them's my stories and I'm sticking to 'em.

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58 minutes ago, turbogrill said:

I think it's a metal fabrication series :)

 

Having someone on the team that knows how to bend and weld poop seems to be worth 40pts

Even more if you are, or know, a good fabricator.

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10 hours ago, wvumtnbkr said:

Says the excellent fabricator....

IF I could attach more than 1 emoticon I'd say "HaHa" "Thanks" and "Like"

I still love forming and joining metal, creating things. That's what's so awesome about ChampCar!

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5 hours ago, Team Infiniti said:

Back in the JC days, people would talk about learning how to do this or that as to make something, now, the only new skill I see people venturing into is manual transmissions...

Just saying 

JC?

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