atxe30 Posted December 18, 2020 Report Share Posted December 18, 2020 Ok, so I'm about to start in earnest on the e34, and frankly the primary target is WRL, and SCCA. to that end I am going to do CF hood, Trunk Lid and likely rear doors(although those my end up S Glass because of "racing incidents"). Does this mean I can't even run in EC at the two events that occur at my home track annually? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators Bill Strong Posted December 18, 2020 Administrators Report Share Posted December 18, 2020 You can race in EC class. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
atxe30 Posted December 18, 2020 Author Report Share Posted December 18, 2020 (edited) sweet, thx. edit to add: the language in the BCCR implies it is prohibited across the board, which is why i asked... Edited December 18, 2020 by atxe30 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gundy Posted January 24, 2021 Report Share Posted January 24, 2021 On 12/18/2020 at 5:23 PM, Bill Strong said: You can race in EC class. Where does this exclude "EC" "4.4.5. Carbon Fiber is not permitted anywhere outside of the drivers cockpit" Another grey area we are trying to close?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LuckyKid Posted January 24, 2021 Report Share Posted January 24, 2021 A hood and doors can be swapped in, what, 10 minutes? Just keep the stock ones and swap them. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MoparBoyy Posted January 25, 2021 Report Share Posted January 25, 2021 5 hours ago, gundy said: Where does this exclude "EC" "4.4.5. Carbon Fiber is not permitted anywhere outside of the drivers cockpit" Another grey area we are trying to close?? All the rules really dont apply to EC unless its safety... thats why its EC 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turbogrill Posted January 25, 2021 Report Share Posted January 25, 2021 Why not just charge points for carbon fiber? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gundy Posted January 25, 2021 Report Share Posted January 25, 2021 3 hours ago, MoparBoyy said: All the rules really dont apply to EC unless its safety... thats why its EC Not what the rules say 2.2.4. EC vehicles must meet all ChampCar rules and regulations for vehicle eligibility. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wvumtnbkr Posted January 25, 2021 Report Share Posted January 25, 2021 The jeep /sc400 that ran at barber had a carbon body. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gundy Posted January 25, 2021 Report Share Posted January 25, 2021 1 hour ago, wvumtnbkr said: The jeep /sc400 that ran at barber had a carbon body. If that's the case then shame on ChampCar, makes it kind of hard on us if they won't enforce the rule we are supposed to follow. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators Bill Strong Posted January 25, 2021 Administrators Report Share Posted January 25, 2021 EC Cars have to follow the tire and safety rules, and we can exclude an EC entry based on a cars power potential. If a team shows up with a classed car that is found to have Carbon fiber body parts, wings, splitters, or other aero devices, they will be required to remove and replace with parts allowed in the series. If they wont or can't, then they are assigned to the EC class. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators Bill Strong Posted January 25, 2021 Administrators Report Share Posted January 25, 2021 Dennis, the car in question runs in EC. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gundy Posted January 25, 2021 Report Share Posted January 25, 2021 1 hour ago, Bill Strong said: EC Cars have to follow the tire and safety rules, and we can exclude an EC entry based on a cars power potential. If a team shows up with a classed car that is found to have Carbon fiber body parts, wings, splitters, or other aero devices, they will be required to remove and replace with parts allowed in the series. If they wont or can't, then they are assigned to the EC class. OK that makes sense, so teams are allowed to race and not be turned away. There should be wording to that effect in the BCCR. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators Bill Strong Posted January 26, 2021 Administrators Report Share Posted January 26, 2021 We don't want to encourage EC class as we would quickly become NASCAR. And you know how well that turned out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turbogrill Posted January 26, 2021 Report Share Posted January 26, 2021 4 hours ago, Bill Strong said: We don't want to encourage EC class as we would quickly become NASCAR. And you know how well that turned out. WRL has a 'EC' class (GTO), and that has gotten out of hand for sure. Doesn't it just becomes a money contest at that point? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
atxe30 Posted January 26, 2021 Author Report Share Posted January 26, 2021 (edited) 5 hours ago, turbogrill said: WRL has a 'EC' class (GTO), and that has gotten out of hand for sure. Doesn't it just becomes a money contest at that point? yes and no. the e30 i built is gonna end up in GTO (without CF body parts) and that's nowhere near as expensive a build as some others in that class.... hell GBU would prob land there as well. cars/parts have gotten cheaper, and while some maybe not as blingy as some others, a P/W ratio is a P/W ratio.....you can build a crazy fast car for 50k these days (which by the way is the whisper # for the maroon NC Miata that tore up HH last fall....) Edited January 26, 2021 by atxe30 typo 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
atxe30 Posted January 26, 2021 Author Report Share Posted January 26, 2021 One thing I might add re the original thread topic: CF just isnt that crazy expensive anymore....but if you are worried about cost then S-Glass is your friend! https://www.corecomposites.com/composite-materials/fabrics-reinforcements.html 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators Bill Strong Posted January 27, 2021 Administrators Report Share Posted January 27, 2021 Yep. we specifically call out Carbon Fiber. But there are so many other high dollar, lighter, and stronger composites that you can use. I in fact have a few bit of Kevlar on my my Opel GT. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MMiskoe Posted January 27, 2021 Report Share Posted January 27, 2021 3 hours ago, Bill Strong said: Yep. we specifically call out Carbon Fiber. But there are so many other high dollar, lighter, and stronger composites that you can use. I in fact have a few bit of Kevlar on my my Opel GT. It makes sense on one level to outlaw the expensive bits, but the downstream side is that it makes certain things more expensive. Pretty sure I could spend less money on a carbon fiber wing than an aluminum extrusion to do the exact same purpose/performance. I'm sure there other examples, sounds like Kevlar is one of them. In terms of it being a money contest? Well, yes it is. All racing is. I think you'd be hard pressed to find a race of any kind that a contestant doesn't benefit from having more money to put into it. The trick is to find a group of people that want to spend similar amounts of money & effort that you do. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bandit Posted January 27, 2021 Report Share Posted January 27, 2021 From what I have seen in some limited research carbon fiber wings can be had pretty cheap. They can be really expensive as well, but that would likely be more the design than the material. A line has to be drawn somewhere however otherwise we'll be seeing carbon fiber wheels and other bits. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turbogrill Posted January 27, 2021 Report Share Posted January 27, 2021 Why not just do material cost? Or is the concern someone could do wing, splitter, airdam, hood for just 40pts? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
atxe30 Posted January 28, 2021 Author Report Share Posted January 28, 2021 13 hours ago, turbogrill said: Why not just do material cost? Or is the concern someone could do wing, splitter, airdam, hood for just 40pts? well if you are building it yourself ya!! laying up CF is no different than laying up S-Glass. since this is a builders series, in this case it really does come down to materials cost. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators Bill Strong Posted January 28, 2021 Administrators Report Share Posted January 28, 2021 1 hour ago, atxe30 said: well if you are building it yourself ya!! laying up CF is no different than laying up S-Glass. since this is a builders series, in this case it really does come down to materials cost. I agree. But the BOD has rejected it in the past. I suggest sending the BOD a petition requests.https://forms.gle/ds3wBsKFTUCm2rSN8 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators Bill Strong Posted January 28, 2021 Administrators Report Share Posted January 28, 2021 https://forms.gle/ds3wBsKFTUCm2rSN8 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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