Jump to content

2021 RA championship. Displacementgate 2.0 and compression talk


Recommended Posts

42 minutes ago, FlorahDorah said:

Ah... um... this may have been mentioned already, but I thought the +/- 2 gallon rule for fuel cells was because it's less expensive to buy a standardized fuel cell which aren't available in all or close too stock sizes? Custom fuel cells get pricey, don't they? Not to mention using those darn displacement balls/blocks....

 

If the above is true, we can't really get (too) upset about a stock tank holding a bit more (2 gallons or less) than the published capacity. 

 

What is fair... and relatively safe? Notice the word 'relatively'. 

 

I suspect if they ever pumped out/in for testing capacity on a stock tank, and the result was less than 2 gal over...and there was no apparent modification of the tank that they would not penalize the team.  I know that's a lot of assuming, but I have confidence in the tech/board/tac/CEO that they would make the right decision in the moment.

 

I'm curious how they would test my stock tank.  It's not easy to just remove the stock filler tube like it is on a fuel cell.

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, skierman64 said:

 

As stated...my opinion. Yes really.  

Opinions are great here on the forum...not so much mid pit stop, mid race.  

Can the refueling/pit rules just be gone through as a standard practice at each event's Driver's meeting for clarity for everyone? We've been subject to Ray's (and other officials') yelling during refueling and while he's just trying to keep us all safe it is hugely distracting at the precise moment where we are trying to stay focused on the hazardous task at hand. Helmet's on, visor's down...so much yelling at us and the teams (under FCY so everyone came in at once) around us nobody even knew who was getting yelled at! I think going through the dos and do-nots BEFORE the race is a much better place to proactively enforce the pit rules and the CCES safety guidelines for refueling processes. Maybe saves Ray's vocal chords a little more too.

Edited by theflyingferret
  • Like 3
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Here's a wording...feel free to change it as necessary.   "During a pit stop,non empty fuel jugs shall be placed on the ground behind pit wall at all times,  and may not be lifted until an empty fuel jug is being passed back by the refueling person."

 

Or maybe simpler... "During a pit stop only one container with gas may be off the ground at any time."

  • Like 3
Link to comment
Share on other sites

49 minutes ago, theflyingferret said:

Can the refueling/pit rules just be gone through as a standard practice at each event's Driver's meeting for clarity for everyone? We've been subject to Ray's (and other officials') yelling during refueling and while he's just trying to keep us all safe it is hugely distracting at the precise moment where we are trying to stay focused on the hazardous task at hand. Helmet's on, visor's down...so much yelling at us and the teams (under FCY so everyone came in at once) around us nobody even knew who was getting yelled at! I think going through the dos and do-nots BEFORE the race is a much better place to proactively enforce the pit rules and the CCES safety guidelines for refueling processes. Maybe saves Ray's vocal chords a little more too.

I’m against any change which increases the length of the morning driver meetings. 

  • Like 5
  • Haha 4
Link to comment
Share on other sites

8 minutes ago, enginerd said:

I’m against any change which increases the length of the morning driver meetings. 

 

Or... make them as long as they need to be but have them remain virtual on YouTube:  FOREVER.   Best part of racing and covid: Drivers meetings that make since.

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

39 minutes ago, Zauskycop said:

Here's a wording...feel free to change it as necessary.   "During a pit stop,non empty fuel jugs shall be placed on the ground behind pit wall at all times,  and may not be lifted until an empty fuel jug is being passed back by the refueling person."

 

Or maybe simpler... "During a pit stop only one container with gas may be off the ground at any time."

 

Totally unnecessary.  

 

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

49 minutes ago, enginerd said:

I’m against any change which increases the length of the morning driver meetings. 

So you wouldn't give up 2 minutes of your own time in the interests of safety up and down the pitlane? I'm talking the key basic details in the handling of gasoline and other pit road hazards.

Edited by theflyingferret
Link to comment
Share on other sites

10 minutes ago, theflyingferret said:

So you wouldn't give up 2 minutes of your own time in the interests of safety up and down the pitlane? I'm talking the key basic details in the handling of gasoline and other pit road hazards.

Could just be added to the virtual driver's meeting.  

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

11 minutes ago, theflyingferret said:

So you wouldn't give up 2 minutes of your own time in the interests of safety up and down the pitlane? I'm talking the key basic details in the handling of gasoline and other pit road hazards.

So where does it end? Lots of things could be said in the drivers meeting which “increase safety” but as the list gets longer, the retention of any one piece of info is reduced. With the presence of pit lane marshals, anyone in violation of a safe fueling procedure can be reminded on the spot. For things like FCY protocol, there is no marshal in the passenger seat to say “catch up to the car ahead” so it is more important to give that reminder in the drivers meeting.

  • Like 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Technical Advisory Committee
7 minutes ago, theflyingferret said:

So you wouldn't give up 2 minutes of your own time in the interests of safety up and down the pitlane? I'm talk the key basic details in the handling of gasoline and other pit road hazards.

 

Nope, we just want to see people catch on fire and burn up.  Jeeze.  Fueling is already covered in the drivers meeting with enough summary detail.  There are the bccr rules that everybody should be aware of and take the time to read and fully understand.  Maybe we should have a pop quiz to get your arm band to get in the gate to make sure you understand this stuff already and that you take responsibility for yourself to learn what you need to on your own to keep yourself safe.

 

I think what Mike was referring to earlier was differences of opinion and what is really a safety issue and what is just nit picky.  Ray bitches at us that we sat our fuel jugs on our wagon to make it easier to reach across the wall to get them.  I disagree it is a significant safety risk, he says it is.  It's his job to exercise his judgement and give us this judgement. It's my job to piss and moan at him to leave me alone I got this.  Doesn't mean I don't love him like a brother and I know he has my best interest at heart, but I would cuss my brother some times too if I thought he was overboard.  Now if I stood there next to a fueling situation with nothing on, then maybe he should come stop the fueling and tell me to get back.  Just all depends.

  • Like 4
  • Haha 3
Link to comment
Share on other sites

3 hours ago, Rodger Coan-Burningham said:

 

It looped from the right side fill point all the way to the left quarter panel and then into the top of the cell in the center of the car.  How would we have said that was from the factory that way?

They say the truest sign of maturity is to write a paragraph, erase it and just say "yep".

 

Like I said - pretty sure that car has moved to another series now.

 

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

27 minutes ago, Rodger Coan-Burningham said:

I think what Mike was referring to earlier was differences of opinion and what is really a safety issue and what is just nit picky.  Ray bitches at us that we sat our fuel jugs on our wagon to make it easier to reach across the wall to get them.  I disagree it is a significant safety risk, he says it is.  It's his job to exercise his judgement and give us this judgement. It's my job to piss and moan at him to leave me alone I got this.  Doesn't mean I don't love him like a brother and I know he has my best interest at heart, but I would cuss my brother some times too if I thought he was overboard.  Now if I stood there next to a fueling situation with nothing on, then maybe he should come stop the fueling and tell me to get back.  Just all depends.

 

Yes, this ^^^ 

 

Thanks Rodger.  

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

23 minutes ago, Rodger Coan-Burningham said:

 

Nope, we just want to see people catch on fire and burn up.  Jeeze.  Fueling is already covered in the drivers meeting with enough summary detail.  There are the bccr rules that everybody should be aware of and take the time to read and fully understand.  Maybe we should have a pop quiz to get your arm band to get in the gate to make sure you understand this stuff already and that you take responsibility for yourself to learn what you need to on your own to keep yourself safe.

 

I think what Mike was referring to earlier was differences of opinion and what is really a safety issue and what is just nit picky.  Ray bitches at us that we sat our fuel jugs on our wagon to make it easier to reach across the wall to get them.  I disagree it is a significant safety risk, he says it is.  It's his job to exercise his judgement and give us this judgement. It's my job to piss and moan at him to leave me alone I got this.  Doesn't mean I don't love him like a brother and I know he has my best interest at heart, but I would cuss my brother some times too if I thought he was overboard.  Now if I stood there next to a fueling situation with nothing on, then maybe he should come stop the fueling and tell me to get back.  Just all depends.

If Ray and co are having to do so much yelling up and down the pitlane then what is currently discussed in the driver's meeting clearly isn't adequate or it's ignored. As stated above by others, there's a grey area which isn't covered in the rules but we are held to undocumented requirements in the pitlane for our own safety. My point was to get these requirements across to everyone at the event, or have the rules revised to state them. I don't want hour long driver's meetings either. I agree on everything else you've said regarding opinions on what is and isn't necessary, we all have our own takes. I stand by my point that getting yelled at and therefore distracted during a fuel stop in itself presents additional dangers.

  • Haha 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Drivers meetings or yelling marshalls, neither are the right way to address this. If you want fuel jugs on the ground until they are handed over the wall you need to write a rule that says so. If it's in the rule book then everyone will be on the same page, I also voted for the petition that the person handing the jugs over the wall should be in fireproof gear. 

  • Like 3
  • Thanks 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 minute ago, mhr650 said:

Drivers meetings or yelling marshalls, neither are the right way to address this. If you want fuel jugs on the ground until they are handed over the wall you need to write a rule that says so. If it's in the rule book then everyone will be on the same page, I also voted for the petition that the person handing the jugs over the wall should be in fireproof gear. 

Why in gear? What about the person standing next to them watching the stop waiting to go over to check tire pressures?

  • Like 3
Link to comment
Share on other sites

9 minutes ago, mhr650 said:

 I also voted for the petition that the person handing the jugs over the wall should be in fireproof gear. 

 

How about all persons in the pits in gear the whole race?  That would be the safest answer.  Where does it stop?  

 

It seems like the pit wall is a good place for it to stop, just as it is now.  

Edited by skierman64
  • Like 3
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Watch pro series and even photographer's and reporters are in gear... I agree that it's a slippery slope and I doubt that the petition will pass. You can argue that any person directly handling fuel jugs is in just as much danger no matter which side of the wall they are on. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 minutes ago, mhr650 said:

Watch pro series and even photographer's and reporters are in gear... I agree that it's a slippery slope and I doubt that the petition will pass. You can argue that any person directly handling fuel jugs is in just as much danger no matter which side of the wall they are on. 

 

Which pro series have photographers in gear?  I've never seen that.  IMSA doesn't for sure.  

CCES doesn't even have pit road officials in gear.  They're in the most danger, since they are closer to the race track and in the middle of pit road with cars in motion.  

BL:  We are good where we are.  We're discussing changes that aren't needed. Move forward.  

Link to comment
Share on other sites

23 minutes ago, mhr650 said:

Drivers meetings or yelling marshalls, neither are the right way to address this. If you want fuel jugs on the ground until they are handed over the wall you need to write a rule that says so. If it's in the rule book then everyone will be on the same page, I also voted for the petition that the person handing the jugs over the wall should be in fireproof gear. 

So now you need rules for common sense ?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

11 minutes ago, skierman64 said:

CCES doesn't even have pit road officials in gear.  They're in the most danger, since they are closer to the race track and in the middle of pit road with cars in motion.  
 

It certainly would be safer for the to be geared up, visors down.  Then at NCM in June they could all pass out.  

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Bandit changed the title to 2021 RA championship. Displacementgate 2.0 and compression talk
  • Bill Strong locked this topic
Guest
This topic is now closed to further replies.
 Share

×
×
  • Create New...