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What are the best cars to use?


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6 minutes ago, enginerd said:

Holy smokes, is that the stroker max m20?

yes, its totally built (so all the engine bits, plus cam sensor, coil on plug etc..) and is soooo awesome......you should hear it.....it sounds like an xfinity car with the exhaust currently on there....

 

as i've mentioned in another thread here, we totally went stupid on this motor, but man-o-man i love it....

Edited by atxe30
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1 minute ago, atxe30 said:

yes, its totally built (so all the engine bits, plus cam sensor, coil on plug etc..) and is soooo awesome......you should hear it.....it sounds like an xfinity car with the exhaust currently on there....

I'm drooling. That is so much more power than I thought would be made after reading your list of upgrades. Would love to see it if I get to a race that you're at.

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4 minutes ago, enginerd said:

I'm drooling. That is so much more power than I thought would be made after reading your list of upgrades. Would love to see it if I get to a race that you're at.

i think the only thing we haven't done to that motor is a WBTB, or ITB's. I've been told ITB's really don't buy you much past what we've done. I'm tempted to add the WBTB though.

 

there's attention to detail with the motor too, things like Jet-Hot'd headers, thick carbon fiber gasket between head and intake manifold...etc. there's way too much money in that motor, its just silly, but again.....you have to feel it.....

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2 hours ago, atxe30 said:

well crap, bad afternoon at the garage. new injectors installed and a re-tune on the dyno.

 

good news: topped out at 254whp/257tq.

 

bad news: either the clutch or the pressure plate appears to have failed at a lower power run and it grenaded the bell housing (i got a text with a nice photo of cast aluminum fragments scattered around the dyno)....

 

sheesh.....

 

That is some good power! 2.7 liter?

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Sahlens Have just about Maxed the Boxster in Champ. They run Motec ECU's, Full custom chassis harness, And Tape for Their Doors, Trunk and Hood, No rear bumper for weight/aero and thats just from what I can see. The Fuel cells in those cars are a $5-6k deal. I assume they Port the intake and heads as well. So they are a pretty good determination of what a Boxster will do in Maxed trim. 

 

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9 hours ago, the5 said:

Sahlens Have just about Maxed the Boxster in Champ. They run Motec ECU's, Full custom chassis harness, And Tape for Their Doors, Trunk and Hood, No rear bumper for weight/aero and thats just from what I can see. The Fuel cells in those cars are a $5-6k deal. I assume they Port the intake and heads as well. So they are a pretty good determination of what a Boxster will do in Maxed trim. 

 

why the expensive fuel cells?

 

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10 hours ago, the5 said:

Sahlens Have just about Maxed the Boxster in Champ. They run Motec ECU's, Full custom chassis harness, And Tape for Their Doors, Trunk and Hood, No rear bumper for weight/aero and thats just from what I can see. The Fuel cells in those cars are a $5-6k deal. I assume they Port the intake and heads as well. So they are a pretty good determination of what a Boxster will do in Maxed trim. 

 

 

But like... who has time for all that noise?

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On 9/14/2021 at 10:50 AM, Grant said:

His weights are without driver. Given the B-Spec minimum weight is 2650, I'd imagine 2400 is pretty easy within ChampCar. Those cars look like they run the stock dash, wiring, etc.

What's this B-Spec you keep referring to and what does it have to do with the cars mentioned? 

 

B-Spec to me is the SCCA class for tiny cars.

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2 minutes ago, Wheelman_99 said:

What's this B-Spec you keep referring to and what does it have to do with the cars mentioned? 

 

B-Spec to me is the SCCA class for tiny cars.

He means Spec Boxster or PCA/NASA SPB (also in SCCA T3)... I started with a Sonic hatch that was on its way to B-Spec so every time I read that it gave me agita... I think he's referring to the PCA derived 2650 SPB weight, although the 2905lbs used in the Stock/"Letter" Prepared Car classes is very telling as far as gauge of realistic expectations.

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1 hour ago, ManhattanMcC said:

 

But like... who has time for all that noise?

The dozen paid mechanics and professional engine builders have plenty of time to optimize everything on those cars. $5k fuel cells and other  high end race items are still a fraction of the cost to run in IMSA as they once did. 

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29 minutes ago, Chris Huggins said:

Wait till you learn how much they spend on engines...

 

Or mid race tire changes of A052s at Mid Ohio in two racecars. Even assuming each car only used 1 set/day of 255/17 tires is $4k/weekend alone on tires....

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On 9/14/2021 at 3:57 PM, atxe30 said:

...you should hear it.....it sounds like an xfinity car with the exhaust currently on there....

 

What's your plan to get under the sound limit for H2R?  With all the new housing going up we don't need any more sound complaints to risk the track

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2 hours ago, ManhattanMcC said:

He means Spec Boxster or PCA/NASA SPB (also in SCCA T3)... I started with a Sonic hatch that was on its way to B-Spec so every time I read that it gave me agita... I think he's referring to the PCA derived 2650 SPB weight, although the 2905lbs used in the Stock/"Letter" Prepared Car classes is very telling as far as gauge of realistic expectations.

The minimum weight for any spec series is way higher than the weight you would find on a competitive ChampCar. 

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1 hour ago, Chris Huggins said:

Wait till you learn how much they spend on engines...

 

It seems like it's difficult to do a M96 rebuild for less then $10k, the Nickies are $5k I think.

 

I guess for boxsters you can find junkyard engines, 911s not so much.

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2 hours ago, Chris Huggins said:

Wait till you learn how much they spend on engines...

 

1 hour ago, MichaelPal said:

 

Or mid race tire changes of A052s at Mid Ohio in two racecars. Even assuming each car only used 1 set/day of 255/17 tires is $4k/weekend alone on tires....

 

1 hour ago, TimS said:

The dozen paid mechanics and professional engine builders have plenty of time to optimize everything on those cars. $5k fuel cells and other  high end race items are still a fraction of the cost to run in IMSA as they once did. 

 

Right, but all that means is that a team with deep pockets & willingness can spend time/capitol to fully develop and optimize a particular platform and execution. If "the team at the top" had a hard-on for a different platform wouldn't the outcome be the same? So it's like EVERY other sport & hobby... I don't think it impacts a handicapping type conversation where folks think a platform is under/over valued b/c of an outlier example. The average player is going to do average things with an about average set of tools. Conversations about what happens when you start not having average players and they start using above average tools, that's a different thread all together (see Grumpy: Tires, Grumpy: Crew, etc...)

 

I got into a Boxster knowing I wouldn't have allowances to do a whole lot, but I also didn't need to or get creative to get that average kind of outcome. Lots of original options and original solutions to lower the relative complexity and keep 'exotic' thoughts at bay.

 

44 minutes ago, enginerd said:

The minimum weight for any spec series is way higher than the weight you would find on a competitive ChampCar. 

 

And of course... but there's a point where there's nowhere left to cut. Further weight reduction starts to become out of the reach of mere mortals. The fact the well developed & aged SPB runs at that weight & Preped Stock class goes yet heavier starts to get into the how low is practical conversation. Hundreds of lbs is a lot on a rig that small.

Edited by ManhattanMcC
for spelling and grammar...
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59 minutes ago, QuaTTro said:

What's your plan to get under the sound limit for H2R?  With all the new housing going up we don't need any more sound complaints to risk the track

EV conversion.

 

Also why would anyone spend lots of $$$$ in champcar, you are racing against people like me! Parts are ziptied and shaped with a sledge hammer.

Edited by turbogrill
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1 hour ago, ManhattanMcC said:

 

 

 

Right, but all that means is that a team with deep pockets & willingness can spend time/capitol to fully develop and optimize a particular platform and execution. If "the team at the top" had a hard-on for a different platform wouldn't the outcome be the same? So it's like EVERY other sport & hobby... I don't think it impacts a handicapping type conversation where folks think a platform is under/over valued b/c of an outlier example. The average player is going to do average things with an about average set of tools. Conversations about what happens when you start not having average players and they start using above average tools, that's a different thread all together (see Grumpy: Tires, Grumpy: Crew, etc...)

 

 

You are absolutely right.

 

In an ideal world the rule book would provide good equalization to disallow the advantages a team could purchase with a check book.  Unfortunately our current BCCR is not good in that regard.

 

The problem lies with a few select teams who don't have the respect for the sport and the other competitors to participate in a "spirit of the series" manner.

 

Where you draw the line is admittedly blurry and open for interpretation.  How much $ is OK to spend for a CC weekend is going to be up for each team to decide, and from those few team's lofty perspectives, spending $50k/weekend is cheap versus what they used to do. 

 

Until the rule book is adjusted or they are somehow told to straighten up, the pattern will continue and I would expect additional players to join the "lets buy a win" club.

 

 

OTOH, the whole point of ChampCar is to have fun and those teams coming to participate doesn't really affect my ability to hang out at a race track, see my friends, drink some beverages, eat some food, and sometimes even race, with my friends and family.  SO I choose to not let it affect me anymore at the track, and just proceed with what I do anyways.  There's always a guy with deeper pockets and there's always a guy with a faster car, so just have fun.

 

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15 hours ago, the5 said:

Sahlens Have just about Maxed the Boxster in Champ. They run Motec ECU's, Full custom chassis harness, And Tape for Their Doors, Trunk and Hood, No rear bumper for weight/aero and thats just from what I can see. The Fuel cells in those cars are a $5-6k deal. I assume they Port the intake and heads as well. So they are a pretty good determination of what a Boxster will do in Maxed trim. 

 

do you know if they run the full spec B suspension setup (x the coilover package of course)?

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