TIG help

[enginerd]

I have a TIG welder and am having trouble. I don't want to spend the time to properly learn to use it by reading or taking a course. Basically I just want a cheat sheet on settings and then wing it from there if anyone can take a look and give some pointers! Won't ever do roll cages without proper training, for now I just want to be able to stick non-critical stuff together. Thanks for the help!

 

100% Argon gas

120v

red 1/16" electrode sticking out ~1/2"

copper flashed steel filler

Using foot pedal control

Surfaces cleaned with wire wheel / sand paper and then some lacquer thinner

 

Here's an example of some steel that I welded yesterday:

 

And here are the settings on my machine:

Edited December 3, 2021 by enginerd

[mcoppola]

Keep practicing til it looks like this. 

 

 

 

[ABR-Glen]

40 minutes ago, enginerd said:

 

 

Here's an example of some steel that I welded yesterday:

 

I am no expert, but that looks to me like it needs to be cleaner. All those craters are stuff bubbling up in the puddle. Did you clean the opposite side at all?

 

Also round things are not easy, try practicing on something with a straight seam. Plan out how your hands are going to move along the path before you start the arc, find things to steady yourself against and hold your torch near the business end if you can. Both the distance and the angle of your torch to the work are important so try to keep things steady. 

[mcoppola]

Man, there's a lot of settings on that machine. Looks like most are close. 

2nd row - Can you turn off all the pulse features? They're rarely needed, and almost never used by most guys. Learn without them, then maybe use them later. 

 How much did the instructions tell you?

Top row features for start, main, and end -  again are nice to have but not needed. You can do all that with the pedal. 

Bottom row - AC Freq and Balance ae needed more for aluminum. i can check my settings tonight. Post flow time looks about right, long enough to cool the tungsten and weld is all you need. 

Hard to tell what all the switches mean but AC is for Alum, DC for steel - AC Freq is used to start the arc on steel, and is used continuously for alum...

IDK what 3 of the switches are...

 

Sometimes holes, or voids, are created when ending a weld because the puddle cools too rapidly and lacks argon. I would disable the start and end functions and concentrate on varying your heat with the pedal alone. It will give you a feel for how much time to set for 'start" and "end" - if you even ever use those functions. Many machines don't even have them. 

Make sure the tungsten is ground sharp to a point for steel (red tungsten), rounded tip green tungsten for alum. If you dip the tungsten in the weld, stop and re-dress it, grinding it to a sharp tip. For best results, grind the tungsten on a stone wheel, grains going parallel with the length. It's amazing how much better your heat direction and control are - as well as vision into the puddle - when the tungsten is sharp vs rounded and contaminated. 

@ABR-Glen had good advice too with regards to hand position and planning your welds. Yeah tubing is tough. i look at the pic i showed and it's not that good and pretty as some, or as it could be... (I'll claim i was laying on my side and working the pedal with my knee on that one....)

[Chris Huggins]

acetone not lacquer thinner, and clean both sides of both parts

 

practice on thick lap joints until you get muscle memory.

 

amps should be set so you floor it and the puddle forms in 1-2 sec, then you back off and modulate.

 

looks like too much filler and not enough heat.

 

that might be on the thick side for a 1/16 electrode.

 

turn pulse off till you get the hang of it.

 

argon flow is important, whats your flow rate?  make sure preflow is a few sec and get in the habit of stopping and letting the post flow shield the end as it cools, at least until its not orange anymore.   what torch cup are you using?  a good cup can make a major difference.

[Andrew D Johnson]

WTF Nate, I thought I already showed you how to weld steel? I'll take a picture of the settings I last ran on that same welder for you. 

If you want I'll trade you for my other welder that is easier to setup. 

[enginerd]

11 minutes ago, Andrew D Johnson said:

I thought I already showed you how to weld steel?

You can lead a horse to water...

[enginerd]

Re: all

 

Thanks for the tips and suggestions.

 

I think cleanliness could be a big part of it. It's very hard / impossible to clean the backside of the base plate. The plate has a 1.4" hole in which the tube basically covers exactly, so debris on the back side can certainly get in the weld.

 

Some of those settings are unchanged from when we were using the thumb button. Andrew was doing some awkward welding and we couldn't use the foot pedal, so the start / end amps were for the binary thumb control and I forgot to change them back. I do not know if those are in play with the foot pedal...

 

I have some 3/32" electrodes, maybe I'll try those out for the next one.

 

I do pre-flow a bit by touching the pedal very slightly to start flow without arcing, before starting the arc.

[Andrew D Johnson]

When you are on (2T), most of the settings are disabled. Start, Main, End, and post flow are what you need to set. IIRC when you connect the foot pedal, its dial controls the main amps. 



Remember to heat the base metals until they liquify, and then dab the rod into the pool, don't stick the rod into the arc and try and melt it. 

I am welding in a cage in Skokie on Saturday, I might be able to stop by and help. 

[enginerd]

12 minutes ago, Andrew D Johnson said:

When you are on (2T), most of the settings are disabled. Start, Main, End, and post flow are what you need to set. IIRC when you connect the foot pedal, its dial controls the main amps. 



Remember to heat the base metals until they liquify, and then dab the rod into the pool, don't stick the rod into the arc and try and melt it. 

I am welding in a cage in Skokie on Saturday, I might be able to stop by and help. 

I have an engine stand that needs to be out of my garage, and a Christmas gift for you to pick up.

[enginerd]

Andrew says that the welder is good. Operator error haha. 
And I cleaned much more thoroughly this time. This was his test pass. 

Edited December 5, 2021 by enginerd

[enginerd]

Issues were:

tip too far out

holding torch too far away

torch angle bad

torch distance varying 

not enough heat

moving too fast

cleaning

 

 

somewhat improved:

 

 

[karman1970]

I learned to TIG on plates of aluminum.  No filler rod, no joint, just plain flat plate. Practice making a good, consistent, repeatable bead until you have it down.  Helps you learn pedal control, settings, hand position, torch set-up, all that stuff.  Then do the same thing with filler on your flat bar.  Then you can move to straight butt welds or lap welds.  Then I learned doing angles with fillet welds, then finally round stuff.  After all that, then they let me try welding steel.

[mcoppola]

5 hours ago, karman1970 said:

I learned to TIG on plates of aluminum.  No filler rod, no joint, just plain flat plate. Practice making a good, consistent, repeatable bead until you have it down.  Helps you learn pedal control, settings, hand position, torch set-up, all that stuff.  Then do the same thing with filler on your flat bar.  Then you can move to straight butt welds or lap welds.  Then I learned doing angles with fillet welds, then finally round stuff.  After all that, then they let me try welding steel.

@karman1970Reading your progressive process description, I had flashbacks to 9th  grade welding class using oxy-acetylene torches. I had been stick welding prior to that, but those methods are/were the perfect way to learn oxy-acetylene and/or tig.

When I went for an interview for my first fabrication job, moving from mechanic to fabbie, I brought in some headers and intake manifolds I built for my dune buggy and sand dragster.  The owner asked if I could tig weld and I said I never tried it. He asked how I welded those parts and I told him " torches and coat hanger." His response "If you can weld that good with torches and coat hanger you can and will learn to tig just fine."

[Andrew D Johnson]

8 hours ago, mcoppola said:

" torches and coat hanger."

The CRX exhaust was done with my tig and coat hanger. I ran out of rod, and my Dad went into my laundry room and came back with coat hanger. I was surprised, but it worked really well, lol. 

[mender]

10 hours ago, mcoppola said:

@karman1970Reading your progressive process description, I had flashbacks to 9th  grade welding class using oxy-acetylene torches. I had been stick welding prior to that, but those methods are/were the perfect way to learn oxy-acetylene and/or tig.

When I went for an interview for my first fabrication job, moving from mechanic to fabbie, I brought in some headers and intake manifolds I built for my dune buggy and sand dragster.  The owner asked if I could tig weld and I said I never tried it. He asked how I welded those parts and I told him " torches and coat hanger." His response "If you can weld that good with torches and coat hanger you can and will learn to tig just fine."

Sounds familiar... us old school guys did what we had to!

[petawawarace]

4 hours ago, Andrew D Johnson said:

The CRX exhaust was done with my tig and coat hanger. I ran out of rod, and my Dad went into my laundry room and came back with coat hanger. I was surprised, but it worked really well, lol. 

I've used mechanics wire before too. Works great as long as you wipe the oil off of it.

[mcoppola]

We had contests at times using .024" mig wire as tig filler to see who could make the best "baby beads."

The skill became useful when welding AN fittings to 5/16" x .030'ish wall fuel rails and lines.

[mender]

One of the guys I worked with claimed a good welder could tig cigarette foil together. 

[wvumtnbkr]

At work, I had to setup processes that welded .0085 stainless steel together with no filler.  It was pretty neat to setup and watch it run for 24 hours making miles of leak free pipe.

 

It can be done....  just not with me holding the torch!

[petawawarace]

On 12/6/2021 at 7:09 PM, wvumtnbkr said:

At work, I had to setup processes that welded .0085 stainless steel together with no filler.  It was pretty neat to setup and watch it run for 24 hours making miles of leak free pipe.

 

It can be done....  just not with me holding the torch!

You'd watch it run for 24hrs straight??? lol

[wvumtnbkr]

Actually, sort of.  It has a camera and was recorded.  Watch it at about 32x speed!

[mender]

1 hour ago, wvumtnbkr said:

Actually, sort of.  It has a camera and was recorded.  Watch it at about 32x speed!

That's still 45 minutes...

[Ray Franck]

On 12/6/2021 at 6:29 AM, Andrew D Johnson said:

The CRX exhaust was done with my tig and coat hanger. I ran out of rod, and my Dad went into my laundry room and came back with coat hanger. I was surprised, but it worked really well, lol. 

  You need to use old coat hangers as they are mild steel new ones seem to be kaka metal. I welded an entire stock car cage, rear clip, and frame plating with an aceliene torch.  Second race that car was in a wreck where it got tangled with another car that car climed up on our car and the wall hit the flag stand turned then went through the fence and landed in the stands. The flag man was knocked out of the stand and landed on the track. Our car also climed the wall then hung the guide wire and light pole knocking the lights off and they ended up on the track right beside our car when it landed. Big time frame damage but I straightened her out, that car went on to win dozens of races over many years..

[Andrew D Johnson]

16 hours ago, Ray Franck said:

  You need to use old coat hangers as they are mild steel new ones seem to be kaka metal. I welded an entire stock car cage, rear clip, and frame plating with an aceliene torch.  Second race that car was in a wreck where it got tangled with another car that car climed up on our car and the wall hit the flag stand turned then went through the fence and landed in the stands. The flag man was knocked out of the stand and landed on the track. Our car also climed the wall then hung the guide wire and light pole knocking the lights off and they ended up on the track right beside our car when it landed. Big time frame damage but I straightened her out, that car went on to win dozens of races over many years..

These must have been old, because I was shocked at how nice the coat hanger material worked.