External oil pumps

[Team Infiniti]

Nope, not dry sump...

 

Anyone else moving fluid with something like this?

 

https://www.ebay.com/itm/391751473327?_trkparms=aid%3D1110018%26algo%3DHOMESPLICE.COMPLISTINGS%26ao%3D1%26asc%3D20201210111452%26meid%3D9103eb49ed6f40dd8d2c42414d175bb4%26pid%3D101196%26rk%3D1%26rkt%3D12%26sd%3D265149659704%26itm%3D391751473327%26pmt%3D1%26noa%3D0%26pg%3D2047675%26algv%3DItemStripV101HighAdFeeWithCompV3Ranker&_trksid=p2047675.c101196.m2219&amdata=cksum%3A3917514733279103eb49ed6f40dd8d2c42414d175bb4|enc%3AAQAFAAACEFuxHQnDS6ApXkM0vtQ9YV0lFh9r3pswdO5I6mPtFiIAU5al2ZNzYWye2XbRb6%2Bbyx4elGE7M2uJeErYFOUb%2FSC%2BOSHM47hb0eIi7zpJs2FHJ%2FvWIgRhj3GAWCkj%2Fmcp5UaZr%2BxpEWtW51HNPc37jhg5JkQUIcjk2Qj%2F13%2FKA%2BzKFrvmvY31opxSYrRl0fXBkhWiRlRtMIKbCDhAYyMq4qGAkKDhIP9t%2FdteFEffJnEnNBz8jZtXKqt6mzUuWQ80yS6ek%2Bql%2FiYuLdpN%2FGDeXIjq1B7S4vkZ1K68npnY0CnLrHgrYCWqTOgxm%2Fzq2dPAz9rncdvHG1dIR9tSI5xmwlrWy6FNgWXMYPepfNJWZougog3Dg0f%2B84yr1TFqQyaKJpUN2H7LhGSFYNG9feRFH1eYVyvNNAPX%2FwHNdVbUagA1ulCnYSBQkyQElJk1jW1lEu1cWLXttr6gUGXnjhp8Q6%2BRqYoVCnpOVK9JBEy1bWXiHadUYn%2FRs2gJY51mPRNPeyuAfLCwqBz108133OgcNi35bDxi0aB%2Fw74oarY%2ByQ9mD%2FWrHnly%2FnfKTBEOap4R6upsKyynTgVpE2Gho7dnedc2tByJmP%2BTQZWRkh0Xr6o8WZp6DMxZgBtu9A1r4bgug5vu7FJJENHTXpJnrx6LUFargOneQDbX4iPi8P0bTeY4Xo46ziEE09zROlj75lGH%2BA%3D%3D|ampid%3APL_CLK|clp%3A2047675

[enginerd]

50 minutes ago, Team Infiniti said:

Nope, not dry sump...

 

Anyone else moving fluid with something like this?

 

https://www.ebay.com/itm/391751473327?_trkparms=aid%3D1110018%26algo%3DHOMESPLICE.COMPLISTINGS%26ao%3D1%26asc%3D20201210111452%26meid%3D9103eb49ed6f40dd8d2c42414d175bb4%26pid%3D101196%26rk%3D1%26rkt%3D12%26sd%3D265149659704%26itm%3D391751473327%26pmt%3D1%26noa%3D0%26pg%3D2047675%26algv%3DItemStripV101HighAdFeeWithCompV3Ranker&_trksid=p2047675.c101196.m2219&amdata=cksum%3A3917514733279103eb49ed6f40dd8d2c42414d175bb4|enc%3AAQAFAAACEFuxHQnDS6ApXkM0vtQ9YV0lFh9r3pswdO5I6mPtFiIAU5al2ZNzYWye2XbRb6%2Bbyx4elGE7M2uJeErYFOUb%2FSC%2BOSHM47hb0eIi7zpJs2FHJ%2FvWIgRhj3GAWCkj%2Fmcp5UaZr%2BxpEWtW51HNPc37jhg5JkQUIcjk2Qj%2F13%2FKA%2BzKFrvmvY31opxSYrRl0fXBkhWiRlRtMIKbCDhAYyMq4qGAkKDhIP9t%2FdteFEffJnEnNBz8jZtXKqt6mzUuWQ80yS6ek%2Bql%2FiYuLdpN%2FGDeXIjq1B7S4vkZ1K68npnY0CnLrHgrYCWqTOgxm%2Fzq2dPAz9rncdvHG1dIR9tSI5xmwlrWy6FNgWXMYPepfNJWZougog3Dg0f%2B84yr1TFqQyaKJpUN2H7LhGSFYNG9feRFH1eYVyvNNAPX%2FwHNdVbUagA1ulCnYSBQkyQElJk1jW1lEu1cWLXttr6gUGXnjhp8Q6%2BRqYoVCnpOVK9JBEy1bWXiHadUYn%2FRs2gJY51mPRNPeyuAfLCwqBz108133OgcNi35bDxi0aB%2Fw74oarY%2ByQ9mD%2FWrHnly%2FnfKTBEOap4R6upsKyynTgVpE2Gho7dnedc2tByJmP%2BTQZWRkh0Xr6o8WZp6DMxZgBtu9A1r4bgug5vu7FJJENHTXpJnrx6LUFargOneQDbX4iPi8P0bTeY4Xo46ziEE09zROlj75lGH%2BA%3D%3D|ampid%3APL_CLK|clp%3A2047675

Wonder if I could install one of these for zero points and tee it into the system somewhere with a valve so it flows if system pressure drops.... and draw it's oil supply from a far corner of the oil pan.

[petawawarace]

1 hour ago, Team Infiniti said:

Nope, not dry sump...

 

Anyone else moving fluid with something like this?

 

https://www.ebay.com/itm/391751473327?_trkparms=aid%3D1110018%26algo%3DHOMESPLICE.COMPLISTINGS%26ao%3D1%26asc%3D20201210111452%26meid%3D9103eb49ed6f40dd8d2c42414d175bb4%26pid%3D101196%26rk%3D1%26rkt%3D12%26sd%3D265149659704%26itm%3D391751473327%26pmt%3D1%26noa%3D0%26pg%3D2047675%26algv%3DItemStripV101HighAdFeeWithCompV3Ranker&_trksid=p2047675.c101196.m2219&amdata=cksum%3A3917514733279103eb49ed6f40dd8d2c42414d175bb4|enc%3AAQAFAAACEFuxHQnDS6ApXkM0vtQ9YV0lFh9r3pswdO5I6mPtFiIAU5al2ZNzYWye2XbRb6%2Bbyx4elGE7M2uJeErYFOUb%2FSC%2BOSHM47hb0eIi7zpJs2FHJ%2FvWIgRhj3GAWCkj%2Fmcp5UaZr%2BxpEWtW51HNPc37jhg5JkQUIcjk2Qj%2F13%2FKA%2BzKFrvmvY31opxSYrRl0fXBkhWiRlRtMIKbCDhAYyMq4qGAkKDhIP9t%2FdteFEffJnEnNBz8jZtXKqt6mzUuWQ80yS6ek%2Bql%2FiYuLdpN%2FGDeXIjq1B7S4vkZ1K68npnY0CnLrHgrYCWqTOgxm%2Fzq2dPAz9rncdvHG1dIR9tSI5xmwlrWy6FNgWXMYPepfNJWZougog3Dg0f%2B84yr1TFqQyaKJpUN2H7LhGSFYNG9feRFH1eYVyvNNAPX%2FwHNdVbUagA1ulCnYSBQkyQElJk1jW1lEu1cWLXttr6gUGXnjhp8Q6%2BRqYoVCnpOVK9JBEy1bWXiHadUYn%2FRs2gJY51mPRNPeyuAfLCwqBz108133OgcNi35bDxi0aB%2Fw74oarY%2ByQ9mD%2FWrHnly%2FnfKTBEOap4R6upsKyynTgVpE2Gho7dnedc2tByJmP%2BTQZWRkh0Xr6o8WZp6DMxZgBtu9A1r4bgug5vu7FJJENHTXpJnrx6LUFargOneQDbX4iPi8P0bTeY4Xo46ziEE09zROlj75lGH%2BA%3D%3D|ampid%3APL_CLK|clp%3A2047675

Those are meant to move oil that drains out of turbos that are low and the oil won’t gravity drain back to the pan. Just a transfer pump.  Won’t build any pressure in an oil system. 

[craig71188]

Also noted in a another pump of the same part number's ad, but not from "ForeveRunAuto":

• Designed for intermittent use only. Duty cycle: 30 mins

Seems ironic that you don't want it to run "forever".

[mhr650]

If you are paying points for a transmission or diff cooler you get the pump and plumbing to go with it. I would really like to run coolers for both but on my car 400 points are just not enough to get me there.

 

It would be interesting to know if the name brand versions of this kind of pump that cost $300+ are coming from the same factory…..

[Team Infiniti]

8 hours ago, enginerd said:

Wonder if I could install one of these for zero points and tee it into the system somewhere with a valve so it flows if system pressure drops.... and draw it's oil supply from a far corner of the oil pan.

Run on sentence warning:

We have had one moving diff lube through a cooler, Im pretty sure it could build some pressure, but amps would skyrocket, or possibly stall the motor but can confirm they do have internal overload protection, although we had a fuse blow a couple times in the morning @ a cold race, we try to warm things up before switching on...as mentioned above, we pay points for the system.

 

30 minutes ago, craig71188 said:

Also noted in a another pump of the same part number's ad, but not from "ForeveRunAuto":

• Designed for intermittent use only. Duty cycle: 30 mins

Seems ironic that you don't want it to run "forever".

We are in a quandary,ours is finally worn out completely, going intermittent and generally sounds sick, just trying to copy what has been on the car for 8+ years. It appears these are all clones or sourced from the same factory by many sellers, they start around $63 and go to $95 depending on vendor, specs and descriptions all copied and pasted, occasionally someone will tweak to alter amps/flow rate/runtime but the pictures are all similar.

 

6 minutes ago, mhr650 said:

If you are paying points for a transmission or diff cooler you get the pump and plumbing to go with it. I would really like to run coolers for both but on my car 400 points are just not enough to get me there.

 

It would be interesting to know if the name brand versions of this kind of pump that cost $300+ are coming from the same factory…..

 

A couple years ago (when I suspected ours was going weird) the same pumps were out there with duty cycles up to 2 hours on/5 min off, the only thing visually different from pump to pump, price to price seemed to be the decals occasionally change

Edited May 26, 2021 by Team Infiniti

[mhr650]

When I have looked at it, a nice mechanical pump. belt driven by the driveshaft seems like it could be a nice solution. That’s how they do it in NASCAR and used parts are always available.

[ABR-Glen]

We used the tilton one for years on another car, still not super reliable even at the higher price and need to wait to turn on until fluid is warmed up. Recently switched to direct drive off the driveline, much simpler now. 

[TimS]

I once bought a roller late model stock car out of a field it had been sitting in for years. It had a Speedway quick change rear end with this pump https://www.ebay.com/itm/253760235523 attached. After rebuilding the car including the quick change I filled the diff and powered up the little pump. It pumped like a champ and I never looked at it again. Fittings could be 1/2” NPT or garden hose, LOL. It did have metal gears. I saw this same setup on a bunch of late models from that time. It didn’t move a lot of hon but it didn’t need to. The one you linked looks very similar 

[mgoblue06]

12 hours ago, petawawarace said:

Those are meant to move oil that drains out of turbos that are low and the oil won’t gravity drain back to the pan. Just a transfer pump.  Won’t build any pressure in an oil system. 

What about circulating fluid through a cooler? 
 

Diff/Trans cooler, this price is a lot less than a tilton, that’s for sure 

[Team Infiniti]

13 minutes ago, mgoblue06 said:

What about circulating fluid through a cooler? 
 

Diff/Trans cooler, this price is a lot less than a tilton, that’s for sure 

That is what we have been doing w/the diff.

 

In effort to keep amps down, 75w90 is used, it also (by pickup point design error) sucks some air rather then a perfect supply of fluid, it works fine with a noticeable drop in temps when running. Without the system temps runaway after a few hours.

 

Edited May 26, 2021 by Team Infiniti

[Andrew D Johnson]

I used one of these exact pumps in my WRL car. It worked so well, I would say it was the number one reason for our success. My only negative is that it did appear to slightly aerate the oil, but I never had any engine failures from using it. 

[TimS]

Oil doesn’t have to move quickly either. Just needs to move along. Diff and trans of course 

Edited May 26, 2021 by TimS

[petawawarace]

3 hours ago, mgoblue06 said:

What about circulating fluid through a cooler? 
 

Diff/Trans cooler, this price is a lot less than a tilton, that’s for sure 

Sure, I’m sure that’d be fine.  
Perhaps I misunderstood the original post, but I took it as engine oil, and other than a turbo setup, you’d never need this for engine oil.  
Carry on. 

[mhr650]

On 5/26/2021 at 2:05 PM, Team Infiniti said:

That is what we have been doing w/the diff.

 

In effort to keep amps down, 75w90 is used, it also (by pickup point design error) sucks some air rather then a perfect supply of fluid, it works fine with a noticeable drop in temps when running. Without the system temps runaway after a few hours.

 

To solve the thick oil when cold problem could you plumb in a thermostatic switch like you use to control an electric fan to control the pump? If I ever clear up enough points for coolers, I plan to install a temp sensor and control the pumps with the ECU, that way you can also log the temps.

 

Edited May 28, 2021 by mhr650

[Team Infiniti]

5 hours ago, mhr650 said:

To solve the thick oil when cold problem could you plumb in a thermostatic switch like you use to control an electric fan to control the pump? If I ever clear up enough points for coolers, I plan to install a temp sensor and control the pumps with the ECU, that way you can also log the temps.

 

 

Our schedule only brings us to one cold race a year, prefer less failure points, also, we are not high(any) tech, just a switch & mechanical gauge

 

Thanks for reminding me to put in a self resetting breaker.

Edited May 29, 2021 by Team Infiniti

[mhr650]

To me installing a thermostatic switch would be eliminating a failure point. I am a big fan of eliminating as many switches as possible, anything that a driver can turn off at the wrong time will be turned off at the wrong time eventually. 

[Bill Strong]

ok. so help me here. 
My Toyota MR2 transaxle has a built in pump. So that's all I know. Super easy.
But the Opel does not have any pumps on the trans, or the rear diff. 
Right now I am focused on the welded rear diff that I have in the car. 
Does this pump need to be at the rear diff level in order to prime? 

I figure that I would use the drain for the pickup, and drill a new hole for the return at the top of the diff. 
But I wanted to put the pump in the trunk, with a cooler in the same area and a naca duct feeding cool air to the cooler.
But the level that the pump sits at is the concern.

 

[Team Infiniti]

8 minutes ago, Bill Strong said:

ok. so help me here. 
My Toyota MR2 transaxle has a built in pump. So that's all I know. Super easy.
But the Opel does not have any pumps on the trans, or the rear diff. 
Right now I am focused on the welded rear diff that I have in the car. 
Does this pump need to be at the rear diff level in order to prime? 

I figure that I would use the drain for the pickup, and drill a new hole for the return at the top of the diff. 
But I wanted to put the pump in the trunk, with a cooler in the same area and a naca duct feeding cool air to the cooler.
But the level that the pump sits at is the concern.

 

It can draw/prime a couple of feet. Last few times we changed the fluid it was with the pump inlet hose stuck in a bottle held a foot below.

Still waiting for our pump, UPS misplaced it somewhere in Louisiana

[Team Infiniti]

@Bill Strong Be prepared, those pumps are LOUD, that is what you hear when driving by with our race face on.

[tneker]

This is what we use for a manual trans fluid cooler - https://www.summitracing.com/parts/til-40-525?seid=srese1&gclid=Cj0KCQjwnueFBhChARIsAPu3YkQe0OPwFEP2SY5tnji2hcwWTAR5c3_e_KrFzH2ubgEM1EjxXSyykfgaAqytEALw_wcB

 

Much quieter than OP.  

 

Used a PWM controller to dial in flow rate for dwell time in cooler.  https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B071W4C6G1/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_search_asin_title?ie=UTF8&psc=1

 

Finding the correct fluid level for the new system is a bit of a trick too depending on your fluid loop and where you dump fluid back in.  

 

[Bill Strong]

On 6/4/2021 at 1:39 PM, Team Infiniti said:

@Bill Strong Be prepared, those pumps are LOUD, that is what you hear when driving by with our race face on.

 

A benefit of being around loud cars every weekend, working on F111's and F15s, and being in a house with 4 really loud grand kids is that you are numb to the noises now.

[Rodger Coan-Burningham]

On 6/4/2021 at 6:06 PM, tneker said:

Used a PWM controller to dial in flow rate for dwell time in cooler. 

 

Explain this if you will.

[kcbhiw]

So far so good on ours.   It’s got about 1000 miles on it and is switched on and off by the ECU at around 220 degrees.  It pulls 75w90 trans oil from the drain plug and pushes it through an 8"x10" cooler on the output with about 12" of head rise before it's returned back into the case.

 

As others have stated, it’s noisy but it gets the job done. They all seem to come from the same overseas factory, but I went with the SeaFlo variant because it seemed to carry some sort of name-brand recognition. YMMV.

Edited June 7, 2021 by kcbhiw

[mgoblue06]

1 hour ago, kcbhiw said:

So far so good on ours.   It’s got about 1000 miles on it and is switched on and off by the ECU at around 220 degrees.  It pulls 75w90 trans oil from the drain plug and pushes it through an 8"x10" cooler on the output with about 12" of head rise before it's returned back into the case.

 

As others have stated, it’s noisy but it gets the job done. They all seem to come from the same overseas factory, but I went with the SeaFlo variant because it seemed to carry some sort of name-brand recognition. YMMV.

Have a parts number on that sea flow pump? 
 

My wife works at a wholesale marine parts house and gets deep discounts lol