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Dynotune gains on 1.6 stock miata


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Hi,

 

I have a stock 1.6 NA Miata with a Megasquirt clone. 

I have currently tuned it so the actual AFR is very close tot the targets below. The maps are based on what I read from forums and a like. 12:5 afr at WOT and 30-31 advance seems to give most power. 

 

I assume that a Dynotune could potentially squeeze out a little more power but wouldn't the changes be quite minimal on a car like this? 

 

The only reason for not doing a dynotune is time and money.


image.png.0c23d4273832684ff63dab301fb3068e.png

 

image.png.8dd4ca6520066ef3842c6454c9c8140c.png

 

Edited by turbogrill
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  • turbogrill changed the title to Dynotune gains on 1.6 stock miata

Hard to say without knowing what kind of power you are making now. 

 

If I had to guess based on my experience with that engine and hundreds of dollars in tuning, a custom tune would be worth about 10%. 

Edited by Hugh Jass
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Just now, Hugh Jass said:

Hard to say without knowing what kind of power you are making now. 

 

Well for that I would have to go to a dyno, haha :)

 

Is there a reason to believe that my ~100hp engine would make 5hp more just because I change AFR from 12.5 to let say 12.9?


I validated the timing to be correct with a timing light but I guess there could be a small 1-2 degree error in that visual process, due to how the grounding is done on the Megasquirt clone there is a slight AFR inaccuracy when  RPM goes up. (About 0.1 AFR).

 

 

 

 

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It's both fuel and timing.  I too would ballpark around 10%.  I am always shocked and how much power I lose when I change things and get redyno'ed for a baseline and retune.

 

Fuel savings is an added benefit because you can tune for a much  leaner mode without losing much power at all. 

 

That said it's always a huge PITA.  At the end of the day is it really going to matter if your 1.6 liter Miata finishes 15th versus 17th?

 

I started in champcar renting with a team that was mid-pack. We just had fun racing who was around us, knowing the car was down on a lot of things. 

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10 hours ago, turbogrill said:

 

Well for that I would have to go to a dyno, haha :)

 

Is there a reason to believe that my ~100hp engine would make 5hp more just because I change AFR from 12.5 to let say 12.9?


I validated the timing to be correct with a timing light but I guess there could be a small 1-2 degree error in that visual process, due to how the grounding is done on the Megasquirt clone there is a slight AFR inaccuracy when  RPM goes up. (About 0.1 AFR).

 

 

 

 

 

We were making 123HP at the wheels with our 1.6 which is a little more than 10% increase from what we had pre-dyno. I still have the engine and tune if anyone is interested in a spare (or maybe primary) engine. 

Edited by Hugh Jass
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3 minutes ago, Hugh Jass said:

 

We were making 123HP at the wheels with our 1.6 which is a little more than 10% increase from what we had pre-dyno. I still have the engine and tune if anyone is interested in a spare (or maybe primary) engine. 

Nice, that’s really strong for a 1.6! 

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These are my numbers:

Stock ECU = 94hp
Pre dynotune = 104hp  (MS clone + AFM delete)

Dynotune = 109hp  (MS clone + AFM delete)

 

Dynotune was with a professional tuner, pre dynotune was me guessing numbers. 

Torque is about the same between stock ecu and aftermarket ECU but topend is higher.

 

@Hugh Jass do you remember the torque numbers? 123 hp is impressive!


@LuckyKid 

My friend has a identical car but he managed to get 100lb/ft max torque on same dyno with same tuner.  (I got 90lb/ft torque)

There are 3 differences:
- I have the stock intake but replaced the AFM with cone filter (will fix this at some point), my friend has elbow out to the headlight

- His engine might be a little more fresh

- He has a link ECU

 

Could any of the above explain the increase in torque that my friend sees? I am sure he also has more topend but don't remember the numbers.

 

 

The stock ECU was on a different dyno, but there are supposedly with in 1-2%.

104hp graph:

FiIgsI_Ekna3b16CBKhuh9BcQcZPWwY5MNPVkVSbqg7bdyCwaS_ak4wYj7DtSDXrHZRI7RWh2GbBbWfRnqfPzIEP1zcZi7FZX4RHtLIj5JAv7BrHI7Ty4fdengC1eDkeLesePHKUEUX46UKCfPwBiFP12je3FnmSb3UU6uW4GtqHDa9s-uLMujuzxMHWL0JyURb9p3173Nu4Yy1w1JOFzQBqQXSaYCIWfxEqYWCOdt2aywE9U6op56AdVw9jPr74KfwgsBXaJ6YDO7jlzpv54QCEUVQcCSqSNkJxviwTLq_DfhlzKMdGML5ZOhhqMFLj1DVL3q7F_QGx0sIXUQQRYrOfoxgbxRRDXjkYTbdRYFZcBRQcroTCGIIxPpmcYGtCH_LLjAehZOPPi2VvAk0p1BXpXv_fzrr2ZyUfT5GiwCgI2soUqHu4LT-c2qSK4gJcD_GSnTqEEqSQg5puZ5jROrqz2jeyq0Abg_9af9xi7aQWakZCACDCusdkMp7NmUAelUy1r0GTJNZQvPp5kaYuV5gX-E1kSMBz4VHUZOn7wZf2j4pLoXznE3bzd70FzGl3N0NnpSVOB7SdwzBJBLiFXFyoFFOijDa3kaTC7n4Vk8o4gtEV21SamqPyUriSKqJJdDFzRG9YVpV5PqoKbBy5s34xqeX8nRYnGTabSV2pmJ45-pS9fNKEbWyZpoQ3iD-1FIi7mLRV0P4lYnqTaTfqtqlDfpBBaZJN6CRlFntOmWq9tK--HyFgQC0lNllpH90=w703-h937-no?authuser=0

Stock graph:

image.jpeg.ca492624a2d65d293a1e010e6984106f.jpeg

 

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9 hours ago, turbogrill said:

These are my numbers:

Stock ECU = 94hp
Pre dynotune = 104hp  (MS clone + AFM delete)

Dynotune = 109hp  (MS clone + AFM delete)

 

Dynotune was with a professional tuner, pre dynotune was me guessing numbers. 

Torque is about the same between stock ecu and aftermarket ECU but topend is higher.

 

@Hugh Jass do you remember the torque numbers? 123 hp is impressive!


@LuckyKid 

My friend has a identical car but he managed to get 100lb/ft max torque on same dyno with same tuner.  (I got 90lb/ft torque)

There are 3 differences:
- I have the stock intake but replaced the AFM with cone filter (will fix this at some point), my friend has elbow out to the headlight

- His engine might be a little more fresh

- He has a link ECU

 

Could any of the above explain the increase in torque that my friend sees? I am sure he also has more topend but don't remember the numbers.

 

 

The stock ECU was on a different dyno, but there are supposedly with in 1-2%.

104hp graph:

FiIgsI_Ekna3b16CBKhuh9BcQcZPWwY5MNPVkVSbqg7bdyCwaS_ak4wYj7DtSDXrHZRI7RWh2GbBbWfRnqfPzIEP1zcZi7FZX4RHtLIj5JAv7BrHI7Ty4fdengC1eDkeLesePHKUEUX46UKCfPwBiFP12je3FnmSb3UU6uW4GtqHDa9s-uLMujuzxMHWL0JyURb9p3173Nu4Yy1w1JOFzQBqQXSaYCIWfxEqYWCOdt2aywE9U6op56AdVw9jPr74KfwgsBXaJ6YDO7jlzpv54QCEUVQcCSqSNkJxviwTLq_DfhlzKMdGML5ZOhhqMFLj1DVL3q7F_QGx0sIXUQQRYrOfoxgbxRRDXjkYTbdRYFZcBRQcroTCGIIxPpmcYGtCH_LLjAehZOPPi2VvAk0p1BXpXv_fzrr2ZyUfT5GiwCgI2soUqHu4LT-c2qSK4gJcD_GSnTqEEqSQg5puZ5jROrqz2jeyq0Abg_9af9xi7aQWakZCACDCusdkMp7NmUAelUy1r0GTJNZQvPp5kaYuV5gX-E1kSMBz4VHUZOn7wZf2j4pLoXznE3bzd70FzGl3N0NnpSVOB7SdwzBJBLiFXFyoFFOijDa3kaTC7n4Vk8o4gtEV21SamqPyUriSKqJJdDFzRG9YVpV5PqoKbBy5s34xqeX8nRYnGTabSV2pmJ45-pS9fNKEbWyZpoQ3iD-1FIi7mLRV0P4lYnqTaTfqtqlDfpBBaZJN6CRlFntOmWq9tK--HyFgQC0lNllpH90=w703-h937-no?authuser=0

Stock graph:

image.jpeg.ca492624a2d65d293a1e010e6984106f.jpeg

 

Was the tuner able to fill in the torque curve.  For reference a good tune takes my tuners 4hrs or so.

 

What does identical mean?  I have three engines that probably all vary by 8 horsepower each all mechanically the same parts.  

 

Once you start changing out headers, exhaust, intake, even if your injectors aren't cleaned and matched, all of these can make a difference.  The only way to really dial it in is to spend a poop ton of money.

 

 

I've never tested the stock intake tube. My assumption would be that it would provide more torque at lower RPM.  I used a bunch of different aluminum pipes with varying results which disagree from the online concessus of 21" length on the 1.8L.  Did you try any other intakes?

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13 hours ago, LuckyKid said:

Was the tuner able to fill in the torque curve.  For reference a good tune takes my tuners 4hrs or so.

 

What does identical mean?  I have three engines that probably all vary by 8 horsepower each all mechanically the same parts.  

 

Once you start changing out headers, exhaust, intake, even if your injectors aren't cleaned and matched, all of these can make a difference.  The only way to really dial it in is to spend a poop ton of money.

 

 

I've never tested the stock intake tube. My assumption would be that it would provide more torque at lower RPM.  I used a bunch of different aluminum pipes with varying results which disagree from the online concessus of 21" length on the 1.8L.  Did you try any other intakes?

 

Both engines are 1.6 Miata with same exhaust. But you are right that injectors, ignition cables, etc might be in different shape. 

Also different miles on the engines.

 

It seems like a nice 45 bend would shoot straig into the headlamp. 

 

I will try that and retune. In your other post you said that various intake could differ a few ft lbs. Also if it's at lower rpm it might explain it.

 

Will do the change and redyno.

 

Many thanks

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